JoeW

I have noticed that the only performance improvements for the 2.8 (30V) V6 are via a chip....which gives you 10-20 HP and some added torque as well. I am assuming this limited improvement VS. the 1.8 turbo is due the lack of air that can be pushed into the V6 2.8 versus the 1.8 turbo. Do these aftermarket engine performance enhancers make an add on to get a true 210 HP to the wheels from a 2.8 V6????<br>

AlexS

I have no hard data, but a chip/air filter combo givess about a 12 HP increase. A filter/exhaust combo gives about a 10 HP increase. Since these cannot possibly be cumulative, I would speculate that filter/chip/exhaust would get you about 17 HP for a total of 210. This is not unreasonable given the specks for the above devices and my experience with other cars.<p>Theres also the supercharger if you need 280 hp. Heck, the fact that your wallet is $4500 lighter should improve your power to weight ratio all by itself!<p>All opinions belong to the opiner. Use by others is strictly prohibited.<p>Alex

Steve S.

That is 210 bhp at the flywheel....not at the tires

GaryJL

You will very seldom see HP rated "at wheels". Just about everybody spec's it at the flywheel or BHP (brake horsepower) -measured with a brake attached to the drive shaft. If you dig around you can find it rated at the wheels but probably not from the OEM. I think I read the 2.8Q is around 160 at the wheels but wouldn't bet on it. If you go to the Wett web sight they have the torque and HP stock and chipped power curves graphed. I beleive these are accurate, the torque is much better (smoother). Don't forget, there's more to it than HP alone.

JoeW

I do realize that the ratings are off the crank and not at the wheels. I am also aware that there is more to engine performance than HP alone. That is one of many reasons why I like the VW/Audi engines with the torque band that it yields.<p>So I am correct in that to get a real big boost of HP and torque out of the 2.8 V6, one needs to add an add compressor such as a supercharger as mentioned? I understand that the more air you can get in it, the power you can get out, and that the chip can only adjust timing and fuel (within certain limitations).

AlexS

You are correct:<p>210 bhp is at the engine, not the wheels. The traditional estimate is that you knock off 15% for HP at the wheels. However, I am certain that it's more when you have four driven wheels and all the mechanicals that includes.<p>To got significantly more HP you would need to make some more mods. I have seen several instances of motors with 100 or even 120 HP/liter specific output (Honda's new S2000 with 120hp/liter springs to mind). So it is possible to get more HP without a blower, but it woudn't be cheap or easy to do. I imagine you'd have trouble keeping the torque curve as flat or keeping it low.<p>My understanding is that Honda targeted the S2000 to come in at 2,200 lbs and so the engine was tuned to 220bhp. When the car came in at 2,400lbs, the tweaked the engine management to have the output be 240bhp. My guess is that there are things at work in that motor that are not available in out 2.8 30v's (i.e. continuosly adjustable variable valve timing) Probably other things as well in there that are not applicable as after-market mods.<p>Bottom line... get a blower.<p>Or NO2 injection!<p>Alexs ;-)

MichaelB

I am running a 30v with Wett chip, RamAir Filter and a Remus exhaust (muffler only, not full catback). Actually, my car was the 30v that Wett used for their initial dyno tests. The chip provided increases on the order of 5 to 10 hp and 5 to 10 lb/ft throughout the rev range (at the crank). <p>The dyno tests were done without the Remus in place. After installing the Remus, I would guess (from the seat of my pants) that it gives another 5 hp max. Therefore, you are looking at usable gains of between 10 to 15 hp and 10 to 15 lb/ft of torque throughout the rev range. Assuming 15 peak, it would bring it up to about 210 peak at the crank. This would only represent about 182.6 hp at the wheels, well short of your 210 target.<p>Last week, the PES Supercharger was installed in my car for testing, which yielded 280hp at the crank (approx. 243 at the wheel). Overall driveability was unaffected, which was my initial concern. Torque was amazing, and available just about everywhere. <p>Without going with a blower, I would think it would be extremely difficult to attain 210 hp at the wheels. I am no expert, but believe that cam and head work would be absolutely necessary to attain these gains without a blower, which could affect driveability.<p>Good luck, <br>Mike<ul><li><a href="http://www.mck.com/a4/a4northe.nsf/372ea83d2e4df598852565f1005fab52/eb52d70b7ed4dd278525661e00683c6b?OpenDocument">My car</a></li></ul>

JoeW

Where do you get a blower for that engine? Installation ridiculously difficult or bolt on?? Any information on reliability of the aftermarket blowers? Curious.........

MichaelB

Joe,<p>The blower is a supercharger by PES. As far as I know, it is the only system made SPECIFICALLY for the 30v A4. <p>For more information, see the post I put up on the last archived Forum. I have included the link below to make it easier.<p>The post talks about the installation of the supercharger, the driving experience, as well as the dyno testing. <p>Thanks,<br>Mike<p>P.S. Feel free to e-mail with any specific questions.<ul><li><a href="http://www.a4.org/bbs/a4/982/messages/996.shtml">My post about the install of the PES supercharger</a></li></ul>