JohnS

At the bottom of this post is my original post on this topic last October... Basically the point I want to make with the re-post is that the person from Audi that showed me the new VAG tool explained to me that the biggest reason to have the over-write feature is not to wipe people's performance chips, but to be able to update software on cars. Occasionally they come out with 'bug fixes' that will make the cars run better, and it will make it easy to just flash update the software on the car by plugging in the VAG that will always have the latest software versions on it. Remember, though, that the process will not be automatic - the tech will have to update the software - so if you have good relations with your tech, you can keep him from upgrading.<p>Of course there will be other ways to avoid having your chip overwritten...<p>- Don't go in for service. <br>Get real.<p>- Socket chip (this could cause problems)<br>Hopefully these chip vendors that are touting the virtues of socketed chips will update the performance chips for customers. Here's the problem scenario: The audi customer's car isn't running quite right, so he/she cunningly replaces the performance chip with the stock chip, takes it in for service and the tech updates the software and the car runs great. The customer goes home and cunningly swaps back to the performance chip, and the car runs bad again because it doesn't have the software fix. Will Wett, TAP, and others that are selling socketed chips be updating the customers' performance chips for them as updates occur? It's a good question to ask the vendors!<p>- Snip a lead on your chip<br>I've heard that you can snip a lead on your chip and this will not allow the chip to be overwritten. Anyone know about this? I don't know which lead, or anything about this - just heard about it.<p>- Develop good relations with your Service Department and communicate with them<br>Most service departments will call you to ask you about any changes they make to your car. A lot of people don't talk to their service advisor to let them know what you, the owner, wants. Communicate with them and you'll find out that service dept. people are human.<p>I wouldn't worry that much about it. All reputable chip vendors will re-program chips for you if they have been replaced under warranty. If your vendor won't re-program for you, find a new vendor.<p>OLD POST FOLLOWS (you can find it in the archives, too)<p>Posted by JohnS on October 16, 1998 at 13:50:40:<p>I saw one of the new VAG 5051 tools the other day. The new one that will replace the 1551/1552 tools has some nifty features.<p>They will be able to upgrade your ecu software automatically. The 5051 will always have the latest version of the Control Module Software on it and can update any car to the latest version of the software immediately. This will be great for upgrades to the ECU!<p>The big drawback is that it will be able to overwrite any changes made to the ECU INCLUDING (as the audi rep put it) "any changes the user has made to the ecu - even performance chips".<br>Right now they are working to make the 'overwrite' so that it is not automatic - so that it prompts the tech to make the changes. That may save our chips down the road. The problem coming with this is that just like the current ECUs record the number of the last VAG that modified the programming, with OBDIII this info will be used to fine shops that are changing the programming if it affects the emissions, etc. <p>The new 5051 won't be out for a little while, and, while not all ECUs are able to be re-programmed through the VAG, it looks like that may be the direction that we're going in. Could you imagine being able to go to a shop and dial in exactly what you want the car to do?<br>Hmmmmm... The possibilities....<p>JohnS

Peter

<br>John,<br>Socketed chips ARE the answer. If the problem with your car involves the chip, swapping back to the stock chip will prove it. At that point you deal with your chipping company. VW/Audi can update the stock chip all they want. If your car runs well with the enhanced chip whats the problem?

JohnS

There is no problem. I'd rather risk getting having my chip re-coded (a one in a million chance) than wasting the time changing the chip every time I go to the dealer. I've been through the whole 'chip swap' routine with my Jettas and it's just not worth it.<br>I do have to admit that the person that came up with the socketed chip marketing plan is damn smart. The best way to sell a product is to scare people into thinking they need it.<br>Flame away.<br>JohnS<p>

Roger

There is a positive 'spin' to this, especially for those of us who haven't yet made a final decision when (or whether)to 'chip.' Perhaps VAG could update the software in my A4 1.8TQM to provide me with the latest 180 bhp specs (or 210, which I think is available in some stock versions<br>sold in Europe. If you look at Audi's german WWW site, they already indicate their willingness to provide these services to European customers via their own tuning operation, Quattro Gmbh ) That way, all the worry about warranty issues would be bypassed.....all for a reasonable fee, of course ;o)

Steve

I can't wait until you're flashed. You entirely missed Peter's point. I'd explain it, but I'd rather converse with people who "get it".<br>

Marko Litmanen

The whole trick in chippingbusiness is to keep up with the latest stock programs and ECU configurations.<p>When a new one comes available, it is a challenge to the chip vendor to keep up with it.<p>Marko Litmanen<br>A3 1.8T Wett 1.0 K&N

DaveN

Reworking boards breaks them. The manufacturer has a tightly controlled process that cannot be duplicated by a tech on a bench. You probably will not break yours, but when you are talking parts per millon it becomes significant. Flashing a part on the other hand is easy and reliable (at least 10K, and perhaps millons of cycles), I suspect that most of our ECUs are flashable though the serial port (I know I do all my designs this way, after all why not?). We are now to the point where most of the componets in our computers are user updateable, why shouldn't our cars follow suit? I suspect that at some point we will purchase a new firmware off of the web, walk the computer out to the car, and update it.

JohnS

If I ever get my chip flashed, I'll be sure and let you know.<br>Oh, and believe me, I "get it." I'm the one that found this information out in the first place, and have talked to more people about it than anyone. I'm just not that worried about it with good reason. People who worry the most about things are usually the ones who know the least about something.<p>JohnS<br>

Andy Hedin

Roger, that would be ideal, but don't hold your breath

ChrisWB

For the reason just explained. Your ECU can get &quot;re-flashed&quot; during routine service.