Mount explained...
12-23-2002, 11:28 AM
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Mount explained...
Hi,
I know there has been some confusion the motor mount issues on these 2002/2003 cars.
The motor/transmission assembly is supported by 4 points (Some cars like the Golf on certian years use 3).
**Front** (snub) - for vertical travel almost exclusively. adjustable (Very nice..), more for manufacturing variances. But you can put more downward preload in them.
**side** x 2 mounts for rotational travel (MOST motor torque is applied in this direction (for inline motors like the A4 audi))- some horizontal.
**back** (vertical and horizontal) transmission mount crutial for keeping the shifter in good alignment so you can shift easily under heavy load.
We chose the 30V 1999 mount since it is one of the firmest mounts, with a good smooth idle.
We feel it is only necessary to change the driver side, since it sees the most load under full throttle. A large part of the thunk or vibration felt with high torque programming is the rotation of the motor counter clockwise then an abrupt drop of the engine as the SOFT factory mount cannot "catch it", and it bottoms out, as you let off the gas from full throttle.
Back in 1985 - when I walked barefoot thru the snow, uphill in sunny California.. 8) When I started modifying cars, I started with a 1977 fuel injected VW Dasher, of all cars- basically an AUDI - Fox! "All motor" it would run a 5.0 Mustang to 60, and topped out at 150 MPH (Ask Dick at dynospot- he remembers it, those were the days...). The mounting system was basically the same as today. But back then I installed Volvo side mounts on the car to prevent heavy rotation of the engine. (that car started with only 77hp- mounts were super-soft).. It worked back then, and it appears to work well now. I also upgraded to a "Recycled Rabbit" poly snub- and it did help firm things up and was well worth while for hard driving. But I do believe the driver side mount should be upgraded for those looking for big power.
Everything is much more solid and shifting is much crisper. Even the stock car will feel crisper.
Swapping mouts is a sinch and is reversable (if you don't like it).
I doubt aftermarket tuners will "make" upgrades for side mounts, since pouring poly/latex into a mold for them is not a profitable option for these moumts. And there are a ton of OEM options. It appears almost all 1997-2002 mounts are interchangeable - "bolt ons". Very nice for us. And superior "Audi factory" quality (and are "hydrolic", oil filled units to reduce vibration).
You should be able to buy them from many sources, dealers and aftermarket, pricing will vary a lot!
I upgraded my 99T28-A4 with both 30v mounts and it is insanely better!! 280-300 HP is too much for stockers.
have fun.. Please feel free to email us if you have any ?s.
Garrett
I know there has been some confusion the motor mount issues on these 2002/2003 cars.
The motor/transmission assembly is supported by 4 points (Some cars like the Golf on certian years use 3).
**Front** (snub) - for vertical travel almost exclusively. adjustable (Very nice..), more for manufacturing variances. But you can put more downward preload in them.
**side** x 2 mounts for rotational travel (MOST motor torque is applied in this direction (for inline motors like the A4 audi))- some horizontal.
**back** (vertical and horizontal) transmission mount crutial for keeping the shifter in good alignment so you can shift easily under heavy load.
We chose the 30V 1999 mount since it is one of the firmest mounts, with a good smooth idle.
We feel it is only necessary to change the driver side, since it sees the most load under full throttle. A large part of the thunk or vibration felt with high torque programming is the rotation of the motor counter clockwise then an abrupt drop of the engine as the SOFT factory mount cannot "catch it", and it bottoms out, as you let off the gas from full throttle.
Back in 1985 - when I walked barefoot thru the snow, uphill in sunny California.. 8) When I started modifying cars, I started with a 1977 fuel injected VW Dasher, of all cars- basically an AUDI - Fox! "All motor" it would run a 5.0 Mustang to 60, and topped out at 150 MPH (Ask Dick at dynospot- he remembers it, those were the days...). The mounting system was basically the same as today. But back then I installed Volvo side mounts on the car to prevent heavy rotation of the engine. (that car started with only 77hp- mounts were super-soft).. It worked back then, and it appears to work well now. I also upgraded to a "Recycled Rabbit" poly snub- and it did help firm things up and was well worth while for hard driving. But I do believe the driver side mount should be upgraded for those looking for big power.
Everything is much more solid and shifting is much crisper. Even the stock car will feel crisper.
Swapping mouts is a sinch and is reversable (if you don't like it).
I doubt aftermarket tuners will "make" upgrades for side mounts, since pouring poly/latex into a mold for them is not a profitable option for these moumts. And there are a ton of OEM options. It appears almost all 1997-2002 mounts are interchangeable - "bolt ons". Very nice for us. And superior "Audi factory" quality (and are "hydrolic", oil filled units to reduce vibration).
You should be able to buy them from many sources, dealers and aftermarket, pricing will vary a lot!
I upgraded my 99T28-A4 with both 30v mounts and it is insanely better!! 280-300 HP is too much for stockers.
have fun.. Please feel free to email us if you have any ?s.
Garrett
12-23-2002, 11:55 AM
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Re: Mount explained... YES!!
YES, the throttle closes (use VAG-com, you can see it DB 054) and the motor loses torque, and rotates clockwise and "drops" on the soft left (driver) side mm. This should be worse in higher gears as the car makes more load in those gears rotating the motor even more, and you shut the throttle, then it quickly rotates/drops back.
Garrett
Garrett
12-23-2002, 12:22 PM
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Re:-VW Dasher.- 2L, Ported head, 450 lift/280 @50 cam 110LCs...
Hi,
2.5 in. custom exhaust, K&N, 1977 CIS - Audi 5000 vacuum fuel reg., 2L crank/pistons (from Audi 80 motor- From Eurospec (Overland Gilroy CA., good guys)) 10.5:1 CR (CCed), by yours truly (still have the plexy glass), 1985 GTI knock sensor ignition rewired, ported (runners/t-body) VW quatum 1.8L intake manifold, -Golf GTI BB t-body..
The motor- Collin Gyenes @ Techtonics Tuning and I ported the head (basically he taught me). After 30hr with the Ferina Carbide olive bits, a huge pile of aluminum, and rolls of emery cloth it was a work of art. I may still have the pix, beautiful ports!
Rememeber- motors are pumps- flow is everything. 75% of the air flow change is in the last 25% of the port (the valves and bowls)..
The cam was custom from Cal-Cams (now out of biz.).
Bottom end was balanced by Sammy Hail in Novato.
Those are the motor- mods. I must have had the motor and trans out over 15 times. I tore it down at least 3 times. Always for more power, it never broke!
The trans was from the 4000. 5-speed, with 3 main bearings, dasher had 2 and I popped 7 before the upgrade. The 4000 gearbox never failed once.
It was a fun car for a teenager.
Garrett
2.5 in. custom exhaust, K&N, 1977 CIS - Audi 5000 vacuum fuel reg., 2L crank/pistons (from Audi 80 motor- From Eurospec (Overland Gilroy CA., good guys)) 10.5:1 CR (CCed), by yours truly (still have the plexy glass), 1985 GTI knock sensor ignition rewired, ported (runners/t-body) VW quatum 1.8L intake manifold, -Golf GTI BB t-body..
The motor- Collin Gyenes @ Techtonics Tuning and I ported the head (basically he taught me). After 30hr with the Ferina Carbide olive bits, a huge pile of aluminum, and rolls of emery cloth it was a work of art. I may still have the pix, beautiful ports!
Rememeber- motors are pumps- flow is everything. 75% of the air flow change is in the last 25% of the port (the valves and bowls)..
The cam was custom from Cal-Cams (now out of biz.).
Bottom end was balanced by Sammy Hail in Novato.
Those are the motor- mods. I must have had the motor and trans out over 15 times. I tore it down at least 3 times. Always for more power, it never broke!
The trans was from the 4000. 5-speed, with 3 main bearings, dasher had 2 and I popped 7 before the upgrade. The 4000 gearbox never failed once.
It was a fun car for a teenager.
Garrett
