B8 A4 Design Commentary
06-14-2009, 08:56 PM
#21
AudiWorld Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
Posts: 1,043
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Excellent! A great topic to sink my teeth into and procrastinate the work I am supposed to be doing right now...
Okay, first Ben's questions:
1. and 2. I think that the A4 doesn't play second fiddle, just maybe dual guitars with one guitarist a little more showy than the other. While the public impression may be that the A5 was developed first, I would expect that the A4 and A5 were designed somewhat together as it was a platform development and there would be the intention of reducing costs through shared development and components, etc. I don't know, but I would expect that there as many drawings of the A4 on the wall as the A5 during the design process. At some point the developments would have focused on the A5 (to match a timeframe) and the design was lovingly refined by Walter de'Silva. It seems to me that once the A5 design was complete, the A4 design, with a later timeframe, would have continued. Personally, to me it looks like the nose of the A4 looks like it has learned lessons from the A5. The A4 headlights seem to also have benefitted with an extra 6-12 months of time. I also think that the perfectly straight shoulder line was carried through as per all previous generations of A4s, while the A5 was given its own distinctive curved line, which I will guess will continue through its generations.
Where the A4 feels like a derivative design is the interior. The A5 interior seems to really work, wrapping around the driver. The B8 A4 did not evolve from the B7/B6 like the B6 (and B7) did from the B5. These are really nice designs. The A6 and A8 interiors work nicely. I cannot figure out how they dropped the ball on the B8 A4. Still better than competitors, but not than their own history.
I wonder if de'Silva was involved for the whole of the A4 or if it was given to someone else?
3. Timeless A4 design? That I am not so sure. The A5 will definitely be considered this, being both first and more importantly a coupe. But I also think that the A5 looks like another car - the Toyota Solara from 2000ish (my Dad has one and when I saw the profile of the car I was struck how similar the two cars looked in shape and lines, though not in wheelbase, execution or any other angle!). I think that the A5 is nice, and definitely eye-catching, but the curved shoulder is way too busy for me, especially with the Tornado line. The A4 is really nice, and I was just marveling at the exterior design all weekend, but to me it is not quite distinctive enough (but I unfortunately do not have an S-Line), and definitely falls apart upon interior assessment. I think the B7 is forgettable and while I personally LOVE the B6 design, but it is a polarizing design. The B5 definitely looks dated but still good. All A4s look painfully bland in stock form and can only approach a long-lasting design appeal in their top form (S-Line, Ultrasport, etc.). I really do like that the exteriors have evolved, yet each looks very distinctive in its own right.
Okay, maybe TOO much time procrastinating... Maybe some of the points are not quite finished.
Okay, first Ben's questions:
1. and 2. I think that the A4 doesn't play second fiddle, just maybe dual guitars with one guitarist a little more showy than the other. While the public impression may be that the A5 was developed first, I would expect that the A4 and A5 were designed somewhat together as it was a platform development and there would be the intention of reducing costs through shared development and components, etc. I don't know, but I would expect that there as many drawings of the A4 on the wall as the A5 during the design process. At some point the developments would have focused on the A5 (to match a timeframe) and the design was lovingly refined by Walter de'Silva. It seems to me that once the A5 design was complete, the A4 design, with a later timeframe, would have continued. Personally, to me it looks like the nose of the A4 looks like it has learned lessons from the A5. The A4 headlights seem to also have benefitted with an extra 6-12 months of time. I also think that the perfectly straight shoulder line was carried through as per all previous generations of A4s, while the A5 was given its own distinctive curved line, which I will guess will continue through its generations.
Where the A4 feels like a derivative design is the interior. The A5 interior seems to really work, wrapping around the driver. The B8 A4 did not evolve from the B7/B6 like the B6 (and B7) did from the B5. These are really nice designs. The A6 and A8 interiors work nicely. I cannot figure out how they dropped the ball on the B8 A4. Still better than competitors, but not than their own history.
I wonder if de'Silva was involved for the whole of the A4 or if it was given to someone else?
3. Timeless A4 design? That I am not so sure. The A5 will definitely be considered this, being both first and more importantly a coupe. But I also think that the A5 looks like another car - the Toyota Solara from 2000ish (my Dad has one and when I saw the profile of the car I was struck how similar the two cars looked in shape and lines, though not in wheelbase, execution or any other angle!). I think that the A5 is nice, and definitely eye-catching, but the curved shoulder is way too busy for me, especially with the Tornado line. The A4 is really nice, and I was just marveling at the exterior design all weekend, but to me it is not quite distinctive enough (but I unfortunately do not have an S-Line), and definitely falls apart upon interior assessment. I think the B7 is forgettable and while I personally LOVE the B6 design, but it is a polarizing design. The B5 definitely looks dated but still good. All A4s look painfully bland in stock form and can only approach a long-lasting design appeal in their top form (S-Line, Ultrasport, etc.). I really do like that the exteriors have evolved, yet each looks very distinctive in its own right.
Okay, maybe TOO much time procrastinating... Maybe some of the points are not quite finished.
06-15-2009, 07:07 AM
#22
See I feel the opposite. I find my Avant to be a very good looking, modern, sleek, and well proportioned vehicle right down to the dual exhaust on either side of the car that the sedan does not have for some reason.
I find the Q5, while bigger in back, to look something of a mix between a sporty oxford shoe and an old AMC pacer. The front starts out OK then the rest is Meh....like an old shoe
I find the Q5, while bigger in back, to look something of a mix between a sporty oxford shoe and an old AMC pacer. The front starts out OK then the rest is Meh....like an old shoe
06-15-2009, 07:14 AM
#23
Don't hate it
Do not hate it, I just wish the redesign had not lost some of the great B7 design elements. I am posting hoping to get help deciding. If no one else can see the "three lines" problem I mentioned than maybe I would re-consider. The worst element in the B8 is the plastic dash - that I would have to lok at every minute I am driving. We'll see - good luck to all of you who love your B8's - I really do not mean to put them down or suggest you are wrong. The Audi A4 is still a great car compared to a lot of the competition.
06-15-2009, 07:31 AM
#24
AudiWorld Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Highlands Ranch, CO.
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Talk about striking the creative nerve...
There's an interesting discussion about how well people think the A5 design will age over on the Audi A5 / S5 Coupe forum. While nobody has come out and said it yet, I get the feeling that many (on and off the forums) believe that the A5 design is more "special" because it came out first and established much of the design language used on the subsequent A4, but I wonder if that is just because the A5 is more of a focused, purpose-built sports/GT coupe produced in smaller quantities for a smaller audience than the bread-and-butter A4.
So what does everyone on here think about the B8 A4 design?
So what does everyone on here think about the B8 A4 design?
- Does the B8 A4 design play 2nd-fiddle to the A5's much-celebrated design? (Walter de’Silva has said the A5 was his favorite design)
- Is the A4 perceived as just a 4-door compromise or mutation of the original A5 design? Or does it stand out as its own original design, with its own merits (and warts)?
- How well do you think the B8 A4 design will age over the next 10 years? Will it still seem fresh and relevant, or appear dated and antiquated?
I agree tha not so much 2nd fiddle as maybe a different section. The timelessness of the A5 lies in the understated elegance that Audi seems to posses across the board. Must be a German thing.
The A4 strikes (and holds) its own notes well. Compromise or mutation, maybe? It has to fit right? Coupes are a special breed as are those who drive them. Same with cabriolet's but that off topic.
10 years down the road? If going forward we continue to see the same designs flow up the B ladder, there is inherent grace that is sure to captivate and be still both old and new.
06-15-2009, 12:35 PM
#25
AudiWorld Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
Posts: 1,043
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Do not hate it, I just wish the redesign had not lost some of the great B7 design elements. I am posting hoping to get help deciding. If no one else can see the "three lines" problem I mentioned than maybe I would re-consider. The worst element in the B8 is the plastic dash - that I would have to lok at every minute I am driving. We'll see - good luck to all of you who love your B8's - I really do not mean to put them down or suggest you are wrong. The Audi A4 is still a great car compared to a lot of the competition.
As far as the dash goes, this plastic piece was our biggest concern before launch (I think I even listed it as my first mod if possible). If there was a replacement, I would probably do it. But it is not actually as bad as I had feared. It almost becomes an invisible part of the package. I actually think that the 'Hologram' aluminum looks worse and I fear that it will get scuffed and damaged easily. If I could have gotten S-Line with brushed aluminum, that would have been ideal. At some point I might opt to replace these pieces.
06-15-2009, 03:46 PM
#26
I am a 'design-guy' so I hear you on some of your comments. Personally I love the simplicity of the B6 (I think it looks like a bar of Ivory soap flat sides, slight roundness at corners). I know what you are saying about the three lines, but I really do think that they work out nicely. Especially when you are in person and get close to it. Even how the lines affect the tail lights is really nice. I didn't own a B7, so can't remember too much, but the B6 has lines that are nice and sharp and simple transitions. The B8 lines are almost like 'pinches', very much like creases. This actually creates a nice effect, and, if I might be so weird - they have a very nice feel to them, when washing the car (freak! LOL). The body looks and feels like a more sophisticated design thinking, approach and execution. The B6 (and B7) is a little more understated and 'classic' and B8 is vying for the spotlight a little more.
As far as the dash goes, this plastic piece was our biggest concern before launch (I think I even listed it as my first mod if possible). If there was a replacement, I would probably do it. But it is not actually as bad as I had feared. It almost becomes an invisible part of the package. I actually think that the 'Hologram' aluminum looks worse and I fear that it will get scuffed and damaged easily. If I could have gotten S-Line with brushed aluminum, that would have been ideal. At some point I might opt to replace these pieces.
As far as the dash goes, this plastic piece was our biggest concern before launch (I think I even listed it as my first mod if possible). If there was a replacement, I would probably do it. But it is not actually as bad as I had feared. It almost becomes an invisible part of the package. I actually think that the 'Hologram' aluminum looks worse and I fear that it will get scuffed and damaged easily. If I could have gotten S-Line with brushed aluminum, that would have been ideal. At some point I might opt to replace these pieces.
Hope you are right about the dash “disappearing”. The aluminum trim looks really odd IMHO – another reason I like the non S-Line Q5 interior a lot more.
Take care.
Last edited by irenesbob; 06-15-2009 at 03:49 PM.
06-15-2009, 08:32 PM
#27
AudiWorld Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: T.O - Canada
Posts: 365
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I echo most of the positive design comments in this thread. No point saying them all again. I think the B8 is the best looking A4 so far. I've always liked the series, and I think the B7 is still one of the most handsome cars you see on the road. But it wasn't until B8 that the word sexy came to mind.
As for the interior, The plastic silver is a bit weak, and I feel this might just be something they're saving as an 'improvement' for a revision. And it is somewhat unfortunate that they reserved the center console button setup strictly for Nav models. It really perfects the interior - and it shouldn't have come with an extra price tag. But business is business.
As for the interior, The plastic silver is a bit weak, and I feel this might just be something they're saving as an 'improvement' for a revision. And it is somewhat unfortunate that they reserved the center console button setup strictly for Nav models. It really perfects the interior - and it shouldn't have come with an extra price tag. But business is business.
06-16-2009, 03:45 AM
#28
I've liked every new generation of the A4 better than the previous one.
From a pure exterior design standpoint, I think the B6 has aged worst of the 4 generations. I absolutely loved it in 2002 when I bought my B6 but, to me, that look didn't stand the test of time and started looking older before the end of it's run.
I believe the B8 A4 design will age well. I think it will age better than all the previous generations but I don't believe it will ever be considered "timeless". It's a sedan and very few sedan designs could ever be considered "timeless".
I contrast this with the A5/S5 design which, to me, could eventually be considered "timeless".
The first time I saw one in the flesh I thought "That design could easily say 'Audi' in 40 years the way a '69 XKE says 'Jaguar'."
That's no knock on the B8 A4. I love my B8 A4 even more than I loved my B6 and B7 A4s.
It's just a very large compliment to Walt de'Silva for what he was able to accomplish with the A5.
I believe the B8 A4 design will age well. I think it will age better than all the previous generations but I don't believe it will ever be considered "timeless". It's a sedan and very few sedan designs could ever be considered "timeless".
I contrast this with the A5/S5 design which, to me, could eventually be considered "timeless".
The first time I saw one in the flesh I thought "That design could easily say 'Audi' in 40 years the way a '69 XKE says 'Jaguar'."
That's no knock on the B8 A4. I love my B8 A4 even more than I loved my B6 and B7 A4s.
It's just a very large compliment to Walt de'Silva for what he was able to accomplish with the A5.
06-16-2009, 01:48 PM
#29
AudiWorld Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
Posts: 1,043
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Note: all the disparaging remarks about the B7 that I have made are all tossed away as an RS4 just growled past me. My knees are weak remembering what a superb drive the RS4 was at Audi Sportscar Experience!
06-16-2009, 01:59 PM
#30
AudiWorld Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 750
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I love my B8 but the B7 RS4 is the greatest sports sedan ever made IMHO. The flared fenders and the concavity of the wheels are a perfect compliment to the B7 body style, which I feel is a bit flat and plain on the sides at times.