Couple of questions after the last unsuccessful attempt to DIY pads/Rotors
11-05-2006, 03:03 PM
#1
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Couple of questions after the last unsuccessful attempt to DIY pads/Rotors
The last time I tried to change my brake pads, both front a rear I did not have a piston compressing tool. I am looking at something like this
<img src="http://www.buellwinkle.com/brakes/brakes09.jpg">
Is this what I need?
As far as How to tutorials go, does this article apply to 02 A6 3.0 as well?
<A href="http://www.audipages.com/Tech_Articles/susp_whls_brake_steer/frontbrakestwin.html">HP2 brake swap</A>
I will also be swapping all Rotors..
I found this Article..<A href="https://forums.audiworld.com/a6/msgs/548220.phtml"> HP-2 Rotor Swap</A>
Anything else I need to know? I am real nervous and anxious after not been able to even remove the pads on the first attempt (in my defence, I didn't have the compression kit..)
<img src="http://www.buellwinkle.com/brakes/brakes09.jpg">
Is this what I need?
As far as How to tutorials go, does this article apply to 02 A6 3.0 as well?
<A href="http://www.audipages.com/Tech_Articles/susp_whls_brake_steer/frontbrakestwin.html">HP2 brake swap</A>
I will also be swapping all Rotors..
I found this Article..<A href="https://forums.audiworld.com/a6/msgs/548220.phtml"> HP-2 Rotor Swap</A>
Anything else I need to know? I am real nervous and anxious after not been able to even remove the pads on the first attempt (in my defence, I didn't have the compression kit..)
11-05-2006, 04:08 PM
#4
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That is the exact tool that you will need...
... you might be able to rent it from Shucks / Kragen Auto for cheap, but I bought mine from ECS along with my pads and rotors and ATE superblue synthetic brake fluid.
Sometimes the caliper bolts can be a bear to break loose, and an air impact wrench can be helpful, or else just a Craftsman breaker bar with a short cheater on it can do the trick too after a liberal soaking with PB Blaster. To be honest I don't remember if you have to remove the caliper bracket or not in order to get the rotors off or not, I've done so many brakes on different vehicles they all run together now...they are all similar but different.
The components themselves are quite simple and straight forward for disassembly / reassembly, but I highly recommend that you only do one wheel at a time so you can examine the other if you have any doubts as to how it goes back together. I also recommend the use of digital pictures when doing something for the first time so you have a record of pictures along the dissassembly steps in order.
I use my oil extractor to suck all of the brake fluid out of the master resevoir, and after I've compressed all of the brake calipers for pad replacement I go back and suck that out too, then I overfill it with the Superblue fluid. (It'll be easier later)
Getting the pads off requires no special trick if I recall, on the rear brakes I remember only taking off one of the caliper bolts (the lower one), and then pivoting the entire caliper up and out of the way on the upper bolt, which provided enough clearance to get the rear brake rotor off the hub (and replace the pads).
Don't use anti-seize on the caliper bolts. In fact I believe that the proper thing to do is replace them altogether, as the new bolts have a threadlocking compound on them. I just use some locktite and re-use the bolts if I don't think they are corroded or stressed and the threads are good.
I overfill the resevoire because the next step after getting the new brake pads and rotors on for every wheel you are doing is to bleed the brakes. ALWAYS bleed, even if you don't think you need to. Fresh brake fluid is important to help preserve the life of the calipers and master cylinder. Brake fluid is hygroscopic and thus will suck the humidity right out of the air, and the brake system is open to the atmosphere. That water will not only boil and create vapor bubbles at high brake temps, but will also corrode the components.
I have tried various methods of bleeding brake systems; vacuum, pressure, speed-bleeder check valves, etc. I am convinced that the simplist and easiest and most effective way is to have a partner pumping and holding the pedal to the floor while you crack open and closed the caliper bleeder bolt with a clear tube draining into a bottle or glass jar. With the Superblue brake fluid, you start at the furthest wheel from the master, usually passenger side rear, and bleed it until the fluid comes out clean blue. Repeat for each wheel, driver's side front last. The next time you bleed you brakes (no more than two years hence) use clear synthetic brake fluid and bleed until it comes out clean and clear. (I do this on all my vehicles and my bike every year... I know some guys that use the clear fluid to flush every time, then put the Superblue in...I'm not quite that fanatical).
The most important thing is to NEVER let the resevoire go dry while bleeding. I check it about every 5 pumps just to gauge how fast the level drops, typically refill it after each wheel caliper flushes clean, but then it depends on how much gunky fluid or air was in there.
In 20 years I have never had a wheel caliper fail that didn't have indications of a leak first, and that only happened once. I have had one master cylinder fail once, but it was previously neglected. When shops try and sell you that you should replace the sheel calipers with each brake job, don't believe it.
Finally, good luck to you, not that you'll need it. Write if you get stuck.
Sometimes the caliper bolts can be a bear to break loose, and an air impact wrench can be helpful, or else just a Craftsman breaker bar with a short cheater on it can do the trick too after a liberal soaking with PB Blaster. To be honest I don't remember if you have to remove the caliper bracket or not in order to get the rotors off or not, I've done so many brakes on different vehicles they all run together now...they are all similar but different.
The components themselves are quite simple and straight forward for disassembly / reassembly, but I highly recommend that you only do one wheel at a time so you can examine the other if you have any doubts as to how it goes back together. I also recommend the use of digital pictures when doing something for the first time so you have a record of pictures along the dissassembly steps in order.
I use my oil extractor to suck all of the brake fluid out of the master resevoir, and after I've compressed all of the brake calipers for pad replacement I go back and suck that out too, then I overfill it with the Superblue fluid. (It'll be easier later)
Getting the pads off requires no special trick if I recall, on the rear brakes I remember only taking off one of the caliper bolts (the lower one), and then pivoting the entire caliper up and out of the way on the upper bolt, which provided enough clearance to get the rear brake rotor off the hub (and replace the pads).
Don't use anti-seize on the caliper bolts. In fact I believe that the proper thing to do is replace them altogether, as the new bolts have a threadlocking compound on them. I just use some locktite and re-use the bolts if I don't think they are corroded or stressed and the threads are good.
I overfill the resevoire because the next step after getting the new brake pads and rotors on for every wheel you are doing is to bleed the brakes. ALWAYS bleed, even if you don't think you need to. Fresh brake fluid is important to help preserve the life of the calipers and master cylinder. Brake fluid is hygroscopic and thus will suck the humidity right out of the air, and the brake system is open to the atmosphere. That water will not only boil and create vapor bubbles at high brake temps, but will also corrode the components.
I have tried various methods of bleeding brake systems; vacuum, pressure, speed-bleeder check valves, etc. I am convinced that the simplist and easiest and most effective way is to have a partner pumping and holding the pedal to the floor while you crack open and closed the caliper bleeder bolt with a clear tube draining into a bottle or glass jar. With the Superblue brake fluid, you start at the furthest wheel from the master, usually passenger side rear, and bleed it until the fluid comes out clean blue. Repeat for each wheel, driver's side front last. The next time you bleed you brakes (no more than two years hence) use clear synthetic brake fluid and bleed until it comes out clean and clear. (I do this on all my vehicles and my bike every year... I know some guys that use the clear fluid to flush every time, then put the Superblue in...I'm not quite that fanatical).
The most important thing is to NEVER let the resevoire go dry while bleeding. I check it about every 5 pumps just to gauge how fast the level drops, typically refill it after each wheel caliper flushes clean, but then it depends on how much gunky fluid or air was in there.
In 20 years I have never had a wheel caliper fail that didn't have indications of a leak first, and that only happened once. I have had one master cylinder fail once, but it was previously neglected. When shops try and sell you that you should replace the sheel calipers with each brake job, don't believe it.
Finally, good luck to you, not that you'll need it. Write if you get stuck.
11-05-2006, 04:09 PM
#5
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Auto Zone loans tool free of charge w/a deposit. I did the rears pads only on...
my '01 2.8Q and it was a piece of cake. Cannot comment on the fronts. Here is the tech article I followed for pad replacement. It was for a '98 2.8 A4. Brakes appeared to be the same as my '01 A6. Probably enough similarities to be of some help to you.<ul><li><a href="https://www.audiworld.com/tech/wheel2.shtml">https://www.audiworld.com/tech/wheel2.shtml</a</li></ul>
11-05-2006, 09:37 PM
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You don't need a tool for the fronts. There's a little slot to prize with a screwdriver.
The rears need the rotating special tool.
If you really did find the fronts too difficult, I'm surprised as I found the HP2 pad/rotor swap one of the easiest I ever did. Maybe you should get a shop to do it?
If you really did find the fronts too difficult, I'm surprised as I found the HP2 pad/rotor swap one of the easiest I ever did. Maybe you should get a shop to do it?
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11-06-2006, 09:38 AM
#9
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A couple of other tips
Get a plastic tub or bucket and at least two cans of brake cleaner spray and an old tooth brush. Spray it all down and clean each wheel's brake assembly before you start working on it. The tub is to catch the gunk and cleaner that will drip off as you clean it. If your brakes are anything like mine were, they will be caked with road grime, brake dust and dried mud. The more you clean now, the easier the rest of the job will be.
Have a wire hanger standing by when you take the caliper off the rotor. Use the hanger to hang the caliper from somewhere inside with wheel well, with all of the stress taken off of the brake line. DO NOT hang it from the brake line, or you may be sorry and end up having to replace those too sooner or later.
While you're at it, carefully inspect all the rubber on your brake line for any degredation or nicks. If you have identified any, start saving up for a set of new brake lines. (Best Homer Simpson voice..Mmmm Stainless Steel....drool)
Get yourself a small bottle of disk brake anti-squeal paste from NAPA auto. It comes in a small bottle with a red colored sticky paste in it. Squeez some on the back of your new pads into any indentations on the backs before you put the new backing shims on, if the pads come with them. Let it dry a bit before you put the shims on. Don't put too much on that it doesn't squeez out and prevent the shim from laying flat on the pad back. Put a bit more on the back of the shim where the caliper presses on the shim and let it dry some more before installation. This may be excess, but I have never had a pad squeak on me since I've been using this stuff, even with pad / rotor combinations that are notoriously squeaky. When this stuff is fully dry, it has the consistency of silicon caulking, and thus I have never had it contaminate any of the other brake components.
The bleeder bolt is either 8 or 9 mm. The best tool I've found is a closed end wrench for this. You put the wrench on, then pop the bleeder tubing to the nipple on the bleeder bolt. It only takes 1/4 turn to open and close the bleeder bolt, and I just leave the wrench on until I'm done with that wheel and move to the next wheel.
It is far easier to bleed the brake with the wheel removed. However you absolutely MUST use a jackstand (or two). Don't just rely on the jack to hold up the car, especially since you are going to have a helper climb into the driver's seat while you have the car up and the wheel off. Take the wheel and slide it under the car too for good measure (this once saved my life out in the sticks...I had some barbed wire fence wrapped around my axle - don't ask, and the only way to get it all off was to jack up and take the wheel off. As I was under my jeep trying to get the wire off, the jack slipped and the jeep fell onto the wheel. It would have crushed me otherwise... I was able to dig and slide myself out while my buddy tried to get the jack back under. I now bring along a couple of flat blocks of 2x12 wood in addition to my jack in my off-road kit.)
A $15 Duplicolor brake caliper paint kit is a good investment too. You could also use a rattlecan of high temp paint, but you'll have to mask off more stuff than with the brush on kit. Paint is good to help prevent corrosion. For that matter, if your steering knuckle or any of the suspension or frame components are looking rusty (except the aluminum components like the control arms, mask those off), then I like to use black barbecue paint. It is a good high temperature paint that has great corrosion inhibiters in it, similar to Rustoleum, but high temp.
Corrosion prevention helps to prolong the life of components, plus looks pretty too. I typically use about 1/2 can of BarBQ paint on the underside and components of my Isuzu each year. It sees some serious off-roading and still looks really good for 11 years old. Preventing corrosion helps make future maintenance easier too, such as CV boot/tie rod end /control arm replacement.
Have a wire hanger standing by when you take the caliper off the rotor. Use the hanger to hang the caliper from somewhere inside with wheel well, with all of the stress taken off of the brake line. DO NOT hang it from the brake line, or you may be sorry and end up having to replace those too sooner or later.
While you're at it, carefully inspect all the rubber on your brake line for any degredation or nicks. If you have identified any, start saving up for a set of new brake lines. (Best Homer Simpson voice..Mmmm Stainless Steel....drool)
Get yourself a small bottle of disk brake anti-squeal paste from NAPA auto. It comes in a small bottle with a red colored sticky paste in it. Squeez some on the back of your new pads into any indentations on the backs before you put the new backing shims on, if the pads come with them. Let it dry a bit before you put the shims on. Don't put too much on that it doesn't squeez out and prevent the shim from laying flat on the pad back. Put a bit more on the back of the shim where the caliper presses on the shim and let it dry some more before installation. This may be excess, but I have never had a pad squeak on me since I've been using this stuff, even with pad / rotor combinations that are notoriously squeaky. When this stuff is fully dry, it has the consistency of silicon caulking, and thus I have never had it contaminate any of the other brake components.
The bleeder bolt is either 8 or 9 mm. The best tool I've found is a closed end wrench for this. You put the wrench on, then pop the bleeder tubing to the nipple on the bleeder bolt. It only takes 1/4 turn to open and close the bleeder bolt, and I just leave the wrench on until I'm done with that wheel and move to the next wheel.
It is far easier to bleed the brake with the wheel removed. However you absolutely MUST use a jackstand (or two). Don't just rely on the jack to hold up the car, especially since you are going to have a helper climb into the driver's seat while you have the car up and the wheel off. Take the wheel and slide it under the car too for good measure (this once saved my life out in the sticks...I had some barbed wire fence wrapped around my axle - don't ask, and the only way to get it all off was to jack up and take the wheel off. As I was under my jeep trying to get the wire off, the jack slipped and the jeep fell onto the wheel. It would have crushed me otherwise... I was able to dig and slide myself out while my buddy tried to get the jack back under. I now bring along a couple of flat blocks of 2x12 wood in addition to my jack in my off-road kit.)
A $15 Duplicolor brake caliper paint kit is a good investment too. You could also use a rattlecan of high temp paint, but you'll have to mask off more stuff than with the brush on kit. Paint is good to help prevent corrosion. For that matter, if your steering knuckle or any of the suspension or frame components are looking rusty (except the aluminum components like the control arms, mask those off), then I like to use black barbecue paint. It is a good high temperature paint that has great corrosion inhibiters in it, similar to Rustoleum, but high temp.
Corrosion prevention helps to prolong the life of components, plus looks pretty too. I typically use about 1/2 can of BarBQ paint on the underside and components of my Isuzu each year. It sees some serious off-roading and still looks really good for 11 years old. Preventing corrosion helps make future maintenance easier too, such as CV boot/tie rod end /control arm replacement.
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