JHM Drivetrain Stabilizer to Eliminate Snub Mount?
04-08-2011, 11:24 AM
#11
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My 15 years as a professional car builder... In the drag cars, I just use motor front and mid plates instead of actual normal mounts. Then the motor plate strut controls fore and aft movement. On cars at the 1000hp level I have still gotten away with the factory mounting points with poly mounts on some chassis setups.
The Audi A6's have a very good factory motor and trans mount placement. The only downside is the are way to soft of mounts for any type of performance and feel. Much better then most american vehicles I have worked with placement though. I have run my personal A6 both with and without and have seen no difference after the track mounts. The motor/trans just does not move anymore... at all... and I have a stage 3+ car with the 6 speed. Lol
The snubber on these cars simply helps eliminate excessive engine torqing under hard acceleration. The stock motor mounts are very soft to eliminate vibrations and make the car appear to run very smooth. The front snubber acts as a "safety" to prevent excessive engine movement if you start to really push the car hard with the stock mounts. And especially if a mount were to seperate and fail completely. Hence why the snubber housing is darn near twice the size of the snubber itself. It can move within the housing until it "hits" the housing wall under extreme loading.
I had wasted money on the front snubber upgrade originally, but its not needed with the track density mounts at all, motor doesnt barely move. Realy helps shifter feel having the better mounts too.
Hope this helps...
The Audi A6's have a very good factory motor and trans mount placement. The only downside is the are way to soft of mounts for any type of performance and feel. Much better then most american vehicles I have worked with placement though. I have run my personal A6 both with and without and have seen no difference after the track mounts. The motor/trans just does not move anymore... at all... and I have a stage 3+ car with the 6 speed. Lol
The snubber on these cars simply helps eliminate excessive engine torqing under hard acceleration. The stock motor mounts are very soft to eliminate vibrations and make the car appear to run very smooth. The front snubber acts as a "safety" to prevent excessive engine movement if you start to really push the car hard with the stock mounts. And especially if a mount were to seperate and fail completely. Hence why the snubber housing is darn near twice the size of the snubber itself. It can move within the housing until it "hits" the housing wall under extreme loading.
I had wasted money on the front snubber upgrade originally, but its not needed with the track density mounts at all, motor doesnt barely move. Realy helps shifter feel having the better mounts too.
Hope this helps...
edit: i agree the fron snub is there for saftey, so by removing it your removing a degree of safety, no matter how small with the stiffer mounts.... seems stupid for a daily driver. did you remove your aux cooling pump as well? lol
04-08-2011, 11:29 AM
#12
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In my car, it's not needed and does not actually do anything. The motor does not move with out without the snubber on the car. If the motor does not move, the snubber doesnt actually do anything. So, that says.... its not needed with the 034 mounts...
04-08-2011, 11:31 AM
#13
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again your trusting that you can "sense" the motor not moving.... when in reality micro-fractures and metal fatigue could be rampant, either way its a guessing game, my point is why play the game? what do you gain by removing the mount?
04-08-2011, 11:32 AM
#14
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Dont talk jibberish 2.7... Stock motor mounts are weak so that the car is smooth, so a safety snubber is needed. With track mounts, no safety is needed. Ever heard of a single full Track mount setup failing? I havent.
No gain in removing the mount escept to the OP who needs the space. If I dont need it with a stage 3+ 6 speed car, he surely will not...
So to the OP, I would say do what you have planned and dont worry if you need that space after you change out the other mounts.
This is just my personal experience. You can do what you like or what seems safe to you.
No gain in removing the mount escept to the OP who needs the space. If I dont need it with a stage 3+ 6 speed car, he surely will not...
So to the OP, I would say do what you have planned and dont worry if you need that space after you change out the other mounts.
This is just my personal experience. You can do what you like or what seems safe to you.
Last edited by nitrorocket; 04-08-2011 at 11:34 AM.
04-08-2011, 11:38 AM
#15
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you have not answered my question? if you have "track mounts" whats the point of removing the snub? its an extra (albeit unneeded) safety net.
also, i have seen my fair share of broken track mounts. even your precious 034's
are you just a troll or ignorant to actual race fatigue that is put on the motor mounts.
your welcome to your '"personal experience" but if you can not quantify it with empirical data or reasoning the you are in no position to say that im talking "jibberish"
also, i have seen my fair share of broken track mounts. even your precious 034's
are you just a troll or ignorant to actual race fatigue that is put on the motor mounts.
your welcome to your '"personal experience" but if you can not quantify it with empirical data or reasoning the you are in no position to say that im talking "jibberish"
04-08-2011, 11:47 AM
#16
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Dude are you serious?
He asked if there was a way it could be removed because he needs to find a way to save that space. I stated that he will be ok removing the snub.
Whats with all your safety and analyzation data you need. Why do you jump down my throat for an experienced comment and want data. Show me data on every other mod youve seen. Such as raising rev limits, speed limiters, increasing boost, etc. In the perfmance world you do what you need to and what makes sence to get desired results to make you happy with what you have.
In this case, the OP needs a way to clear space, so I presented one. You have a better one.
Im not here to argue about insignificant B.S.
Im done, curse me for providing viable options... Won't let it happen again.
He asked if there was a way it could be removed because he needs to find a way to save that space. I stated that he will be ok removing the snub.
Whats with all your safety and analyzation data you need. Why do you jump down my throat for an experienced comment and want data. Show me data on every other mod youve seen. Such as raising rev limits, speed limiters, increasing boost, etc. In the perfmance world you do what you need to and what makes sence to get desired results to make you happy with what you have.
In this case, the OP needs a way to clear space, so I presented one. You have a better one.
Im not here to argue about insignificant B.S.
Im done, curse me for providing viable options... Won't let it happen again.
04-08-2011, 11:50 AM
#17
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mount failure is not insignificant, he also stated that he could work around the snub if he had to.
seriously if you've built so many race cars then you should know the issues with metal fatigue on drivetrain mounting points
for a daily driver why risk the damage? he asked if it could be done, yes.
what he needed to ask is should it be done?
sorry for coming at you with real engineering based questions. I dont know how they do it down in your neck of the woods, but ill try to remember im talking with a backyard racer next time
seriously if you've built so many race cars then you should know the issues with metal fatigue on drivetrain mounting points
for a daily driver why risk the damage? he asked if it could be done, yes.
what he needed to ask is should it be done?
sorry for coming at you with real engineering based questions. I dont know how they do it down in your neck of the woods, but ill try to remember im talking with a backyard racer next time
04-08-2011, 11:53 AM
#18
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Show me data on every other mod youve seen. Such as raising rev limits, speed limiters, increasing boost, etc. In the perfmance world you do what you need to and what makes sence to get desired results to make you happy with what you have.
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hes not asking about mods.... and i would ask the SAME questions. you want to blow up your cars im fine with it, but i feel like AW is here to present knowledgeable information so people can make the right choice and choose the risks that are best suited to their needs... all your offering is "yeah dude go do it because i did it and had no problems" it doesn't take a statistics major to know that 1 person a solution does not make
[/QUOTE]
hes not asking about mods.... and i would ask the SAME questions. you want to blow up your cars im fine with it, but i feel like AW is here to present knowledgeable information so people can make the right choice and choose the risks that are best suited to their needs... all your offering is "yeah dude go do it because i did it and had no problems" it doesn't take a statistics major to know that 1 person a solution does not make
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