Lambo V10 For New RS6 - might be a repost...
03-12-2004, 08:54 AM
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Lambo V10 For New RS6 - might be a repost...
Audi's all-new A6 will eventually flower into a V10-engined mega-saloon, according to sources within the company.
The next-generation S6 is expected to get an upgrade and be fitted with a twin-turbo V8, but it will be topped by an extreme RS6 replacement fitted with a de-tuned
5-litre V10 borrowed from the Lamborghini Gallardo. This engine will also be used in Audi's upcoming Le Mans Quattro supercar and provides competition for BMW's forthcoming V10-engined M5.
The new A6 also marks the beginning of an attempt to reinvent the maker as a sporting brand: 'sport and Audi go together', according to one talking head at the recent London unveiling. Audi is also claiming that the A6 will be 'the most sporting saloon in the sector'.
The new A6 has a longitudinally-mounted engine, wishbone front suspension and now a complex multi-link rear axle on both front- and all-wheel drive versions. Audi's launch blurb also says that the car has a new 'ML' transmission, standing for 'Manual Longitudinal'. This new design allows Audi's engineers to mount the engines further back in the nose - or perhaps allows the front wheels to be placed further forward: some 83mm has been liberated according to Audi's Dr Horst Glaser. Although this may not sound much, the A6's weight distribution is now 59 per cent front/ 41 per cent rear, a much-needed improvement.
Having a powerplant that overhangs the front wheels has been the root cause of criticisms concerning the handling, steering feel and balance of various Audis for years. Moving the engine rearwards might also explain how it's possible to fit a detuned version of the Gallardo's V10 into the nose of the next-generation RS6.
Ahead of the launch, a senior Audi source told evo that the company's new design language had one aim: 'to stop us fading into the background'. There's no doubt that the A6 is more flashy than previous Audis and that it finally breaks with the hugely successful design language established with the 100 and 80 models of the late 1980s.
Perhaps an even bigger design revolution has been wrought inside. The A6's interior has been completely re-thought and is much 'busier' and more 'technical' than any previous Audi. It's also much more switch-laden and gets the MMI control set-up with a 6.5in monochrome television screen. Ritzier versions get a colour screen.
In the flesh, the new A6 shows evidence that Chris Bangle's radical BMWs have started to influence rivals. How utterly ironic, then, that Bangle should be kicked upstairs by BMW into an executive role just days ahead of the A6 unveiling.
Unlike the current car - which is sister to the VW Passat - this A6 doesn't currently share its chassis with any another VW Group brand. The steel monocoque is said to be 36 per cent stiffer and rear legroom is up by an appreciable 83mm.
Five new engines are lined up for launch with a 335bhp 4.2-litre V8 at the top. Also on offer is a 255bhp 3.2-litre FSI V6, a 177bhp 2.4-litre V6 and two diesels; a 225bhp 3-litre TDI and a 140bhp 2-litre TDI. Interestingly, more than 50 per cent of current A6 sales are diesel-powered. Both the V8 and V6 motors are based on the same - new - 90degree architecture (as is the Gallardo V10) with just 90mm between bore-centres. This design aims to reduce frontal weight-bias.
All models get the new six-speed manual 'box or a six-speed auto. There's also the option of the unique - and superb - stepless Multitronic transmission. Quattro all-wheel drive is standard on the 4.2 and 3.0 TDi models. Adaptive air suspension will be offered as an option from early next year. Standard kit includes speed-dependent assisted steering, an electric parking brake, automatic air-con and rain and light sensors.
With Mercedes experiencing quality problems with the E-class and BMW suffering from experimental design with the 5-series, Audi has never had a better chance to take this sector by storm. The new A6 saloon range goes on sale from June while the Avant estate follows next year. Plans are also afoot for a coupe version.
The next-generation S6 is expected to get an upgrade and be fitted with a twin-turbo V8, but it will be topped by an extreme RS6 replacement fitted with a de-tuned
5-litre V10 borrowed from the Lamborghini Gallardo. This engine will also be used in Audi's upcoming Le Mans Quattro supercar and provides competition for BMW's forthcoming V10-engined M5.
The new A6 also marks the beginning of an attempt to reinvent the maker as a sporting brand: 'sport and Audi go together', according to one talking head at the recent London unveiling. Audi is also claiming that the A6 will be 'the most sporting saloon in the sector'.
The new A6 has a longitudinally-mounted engine, wishbone front suspension and now a complex multi-link rear axle on both front- and all-wheel drive versions. Audi's launch blurb also says that the car has a new 'ML' transmission, standing for 'Manual Longitudinal'. This new design allows Audi's engineers to mount the engines further back in the nose - or perhaps allows the front wheels to be placed further forward: some 83mm has been liberated according to Audi's Dr Horst Glaser. Although this may not sound much, the A6's weight distribution is now 59 per cent front/ 41 per cent rear, a much-needed improvement.
Having a powerplant that overhangs the front wheels has been the root cause of criticisms concerning the handling, steering feel and balance of various Audis for years. Moving the engine rearwards might also explain how it's possible to fit a detuned version of the Gallardo's V10 into the nose of the next-generation RS6.
Ahead of the launch, a senior Audi source told evo that the company's new design language had one aim: 'to stop us fading into the background'. There's no doubt that the A6 is more flashy than previous Audis and that it finally breaks with the hugely successful design language established with the 100 and 80 models of the late 1980s.
Perhaps an even bigger design revolution has been wrought inside. The A6's interior has been completely re-thought and is much 'busier' and more 'technical' than any previous Audi. It's also much more switch-laden and gets the MMI control set-up with a 6.5in monochrome television screen. Ritzier versions get a colour screen.
In the flesh, the new A6 shows evidence that Chris Bangle's radical BMWs have started to influence rivals. How utterly ironic, then, that Bangle should be kicked upstairs by BMW into an executive role just days ahead of the A6 unveiling.
Unlike the current car - which is sister to the VW Passat - this A6 doesn't currently share its chassis with any another VW Group brand. The steel monocoque is said to be 36 per cent stiffer and rear legroom is up by an appreciable 83mm.
Five new engines are lined up for launch with a 335bhp 4.2-litre V8 at the top. Also on offer is a 255bhp 3.2-litre FSI V6, a 177bhp 2.4-litre V6 and two diesels; a 225bhp 3-litre TDI and a 140bhp 2-litre TDI. Interestingly, more than 50 per cent of current A6 sales are diesel-powered. Both the V8 and V6 motors are based on the same - new - 90degree architecture (as is the Gallardo V10) with just 90mm between bore-centres. This design aims to reduce frontal weight-bias.
All models get the new six-speed manual 'box or a six-speed auto. There's also the option of the unique - and superb - stepless Multitronic transmission. Quattro all-wheel drive is standard on the 4.2 and 3.0 TDi models. Adaptive air suspension will be offered as an option from early next year. Standard kit includes speed-dependent assisted steering, an electric parking brake, automatic air-con and rain and light sensors.
With Mercedes experiencing quality problems with the E-class and BMW suffering from experimental design with the 5-series, Audi has never had a better chance to take this sector by storm. The new A6 saloon range goes on sale from June while the Avant estate follows next year. Plans are also afoot for a coupe version.
03-12-2004, 09:01 AM
#2
Write-up from Evo. May have the engine/model (S6/RS6) mixed up ;-)
(this according to my source in Germany)
The RS6 has been a go all along, but the S6 has been under possible production scrutiny only recently. The C6 chassis was designed from the start to accomdate the twin turbo V8. However, the V10 was not in the cards for the sedan/avant. Plans are now being considered to make an S6. That car would get a de-tuned V10. This would require a new firewall and possibly even changes o floorpan, as the engine would extend rearward further than planned. As a result, steering and driveline might need to be changed. Whether this is feasible, is undecided at this point. Some of it has to do with what direction they want the A6 coupe to take.
The RS6 has been a go all along, but the S6 has been under possible production scrutiny only recently. The C6 chassis was designed from the start to accomdate the twin turbo V8. However, the V10 was not in the cards for the sedan/avant. Plans are now being considered to make an S6. That car would get a de-tuned V10. This would require a new firewall and possibly even changes o floorpan, as the engine would extend rearward further than planned. As a result, steering and driveline might need to be changed. Whether this is feasible, is undecided at this point. Some of it has to do with what direction they want the A6 coupe to take.
03-12-2004, 09:01 AM
#3
Good story, but some BS throughout.
59/41 weight distribution is not a significant improvement at all (maybe 1% shift). Put a V10 in it, and you'll need to put ballast in the trunk to keep the rear wheels on the ground!
03-12-2004, 09:13 AM
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Yeah, I wondered about that weight thing
As it is, the car is very front-heavy - I don't know HOW BMW gets it so balanced, with a front-engine car, but if you stick a V10 in the RS6 (or S6) you have a much heavier engine than what is in there already, so you probably end up with 65/35, or the balance of a freight train with an empty caboose.
03-12-2004, 09:15 AM
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Typical press release info. Makes no progress sound like progress.
The weight distribution of quattro Audi sedans has always been 59/41. There are only a few that are worse. So if the new A6 still has the same figure, there has been no improvement. I've been hearing things like 55/45, and I was hoping that was the case.
The ML transmission is already in use in the S4 and some european A4s. It still overhangs the engine off the front wheel centerline, so it looks like the rumors of Audi moving the front wheels forward are either wrong or something we won't see till the B7 A4.
The bore center stats on the engine are misleading, also. The older Audi engines had 84mm bore centers, the old 4.2 had 88mm bore centers, and the new ones (V10, chain driven V8, 3.2 v6) are 90, so compactness has moved slightly backwards, not improved.
Don't get me wrong. Audi is my favorite brand, but I think they need to address the long front overhang/front heavy weight dist. once and for all. That's my only real disappointment with the new A6.
The ML transmission is already in use in the S4 and some european A4s. It still overhangs the engine off the front wheel centerline, so it looks like the rumors of Audi moving the front wheels forward are either wrong or something we won't see till the B7 A4.
The bore center stats on the engine are misleading, also. The older Audi engines had 84mm bore centers, the old 4.2 had 88mm bore centers, and the new ones (V10, chain driven V8, 3.2 v6) are 90, so compactness has moved slightly backwards, not improved.
Don't get me wrong. Audi is my favorite brand, but I think they need to address the long front overhang/front heavy weight dist. once and for all. That's my only real disappointment with the new A6.
03-12-2004, 09:27 AM
#7
Yes it does. The question is if it ties into the coupe some way.
Of course they spent mega-bucks to convert the C5 to fit the V8, so perhaps they think there is too large a gap between the upcoming RS6 and the regular 4.2.