Dangler {/KAWF} BUMP

would you seriously compare the s6 to an m5 anyways? The 540i doesn't compare, but its much closer

Jim Lamb

I've heard that it will come in Avant form only (which, frankly, is fine with me), but no word on manual vs. automatic transmission. I know a lot of Americans have something against wagons, but they're as popular in Europe as SUV's are here and are much more practical. Hunt's just listening to the analysts who have been predicting the resurgence of the wagon for over a year now.

Brian-PA

or it could be as simple as their market research indicated that a majority of the target demographic would opt for the tip. I am not inferring that this is accurate or appropriate but obviously some dynamic exists that would preclude the inclusion of a six speed and the sedan for that matter. It either confilcts with current or future investments and strategies.

It could also be poor planning or Audi miscalculated the popularity of it's vehicles. The 3.0L, 2.7T and an S6 Sedan/M to replace the 2.8 fwd/quattro would have been a better bet than the retuned 2.8, 2.7T, and 4.2. Then the Avant could have been introduced after determining N.A. preferences.

One last theory is that they are still P.O.'d that we Americans sue the hell out of everyone and everything for anything so Audi A.G. treats us as second class enthusiasts. However this consipiracy theory is really out there. A company acknowledges one thing when growing, revenues. Audi is no different. They need/want to make money. So toss out my no. 3.

I myself would opt for the tip because the other part of my balance sheet would not be able to drive it when necessary. In my case it is not as simple as saying "don't let her drive it" or "teach her how to drive a manual." It's not going to happen. So I would, and do, like the S6 Avant and I would need to opt for the tip based on my situation.

I do sympathize with those who do have the flexibility to get the six speed and are frustrated at not having the option. Audi could make the six speed standard and the tip optional ($$). They would make some money and keep the auto mag's and the purists satisfied.

My .02.

P.S. I certainly hope they do not introduce the S6 as a tip only and then second guess their strategy 12-18 months later and offer the six speed. Many people will be mighty irritated at that move plus it would disenfranchise those who compromised and took the tip.

mpuzach

For a self-proclaimed "former geezer", your mind is incredibly sharp!

TM

I agree that the 4.2L cars should be offered with a manual transmission and it's a real shame that the S8 is offered only in a tiptronic.

A friend of mine would buy an S8 on the spot if it were offered in 6-speed. He's not even much of a car enthusiast, but the Tiptronic-only kills his interest in the highest performance Audi available.

As for resale value, I think you're completely off-base. The high-end Audis have horrible resale value. '97 A8s are going for $30k and under from time to time, and they're all well under $40k now. That's losing a good $20k+ in three years' time. The '97 S6 (if one can be found) is worth less than $30k now unless it's totally pristine and/or heavily upgraded- see karquattro for examples. I think, unfortunately, that the lack of an automatic transmission option (at least) really hurt the resale value of the older S cars. I totally disagree w/ that, but that's beside the point.

rmg1

for a product launch. And some other stuff. I've been checking the board every few days.

I'll be in touch.

Audi A6
Black / Van. Onx.

Finman

I have not been to the Detroit Auto Show, but did not see anything in the press releases specifying which transmission(s) will be available.
I wish the 4.2 had been available as a manual, but Audi likely realizes that statistically very few 4.2s would be sold with a stick. 4.2s tend to be sold to older (50s--unlike myself), males who for whatever reason are tired of shifting, too lazy or unspirited, or have a wife who wants a manual. Having a stick 2.7T satisfies most and if the S6 comes with a stick, that would certainly suck up almost everyone who wants a 4.2 stick. Still, I suspect, given the median age of the prospective S6 buyer, most (3/4??) will get the auto. I don't know why Audi would not offer both as they would likely almost all be "pre-sold" and ordered so they would not have lots of the undersirables (automatics) laying around on lots, but who knows?
I have actually never driven an A6 with a stick, but it seems like a lot of people complain that the gearbox sucks anyway. Is there another, quicker, smoother shifting gearbox on the S6 in Europe than the apparent piece of crap in the 2.7T/allroad? Prior to my one month old 4.2, I had selected my own gears for the past 15 years and if it were not for one of the above reasons, would continue to be, but if it came down to a stiff shifting bucket of rocks manual vs. a relatively silky smooth auto (err tip), I'd rather let the car do the work.
When can I place my order for my (err my wife's) S6 Avant to replace the Outback?

Finman

I'm no Kelly Blue Book or anything, but I think in general resale is more a function of percentage of original cost and model year age. A '97 is now 4 years old no matter when it was bought and in general, 50% is not a bad number at 4 years. Certainly, Porsche does a lot better, Mercedes and BMW do somewhat better, but used car dealer lot prices are much higher than the "trade-in" value or "private-party" sale price. Overall, I think Audi is the "average" category for resale, along with Honda, Toyota, and even Lexus. Mercedes above average and unique exoticars on their own scale.
I agree resale value of the earlier S models would be hurt by lack of an auto. Old, wealthy people like autos. Old, crazy wealthy people like sticks. I like sticks, but I'm not old, crazy, or wealthy

Alec

They're making my head spin with their market strategies and their Audi Adidas Kobe shoes.
7% more plastic! in the new A4, and all of it just for your benefit. My 2 cents is: S4 owners who are on their 3rd transissions aren't so thrilled about manual transission. Some Volkswagen wide problem about 2nd gear syncro -something. If you got TIP from Volksagen you the reliablity choice award. It might be some consolation.

muhammadc

'97 S6's weren't sold here and any you see from KAR are Canadian models I believe... how many could have possibly been sold? KAR is the only source I have seen. I wouldn't include them since for whatever reason KAR always has them priced the same as/close to '95-'95.5 models...

The resale I am talking about is the '92-'95.5 S4/S6... no other models, really, and certainly not the A8. The UrS4's are still up at $15k-$18k (some more, some less) and that's with 75k+ miles... and a car that is 7-9 years old.

S6's are selling at $22k-$28k it seems... some '95.5s ('96) are up over $30k. Of course, since it is a rare car and only so many people want them, there aren't sales of them all the time... very few actually. But that doesn't drive the price down. Remember, these cars sold for $49k new, and have held 45-65% of their value after 5 years. Compare that to the A6s, which only hold 30-45% of their value after 5 years.

By keeping the car rare and a true performance car, they demand high resale... and my point is if Audi brought real performance cars, and limited them, we would see that type of resale value again. But as long as they would bring, say, 5,000 S6 avants here... that won't happen. (300-some S6 avants were brought in '95-'96) If Audi made 5,000 automatic UrS6's then the resale value wouldn't be any good on those either, and I would own one! So I have to say that I don't think offering a performance car with an automatic helps resale.

Just FWIW, a quick calculation I made of resale values....

A6 4.2 = 78-88% value after 1 year
A6 2.7T = 75-89% value after 1 year
A6 2.8 = 75-88% value after 1 year