When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
I got mine at RockAuto. Believe it was UltraPower branded. I did change the camshaft seals but not on the exhaust side cam under the cam gear because I didn't remove anything on that side to do the job.
Thank you very much. Would you know the necessary references to do the same as you, change the seal and perhaps the cap?
Its been ~16,000km since doing the tensioner job. Late last year the car started to make a rattling start up noise again but this time it sounded more like a loose internal exhaust component that would fix itself very shortly after 20 seconds or so of the engine running. The car ran fine after startup and no additional noise was heard, full of power etc. Stethoscope probing didn't clearly help identify what the source of the noise was either as it was too short to catch. I was gifted a bore scope and used it inside the drivers valve cover and was able to see some damage to the cam sprocket.
As these are oil pressure driven tensioners, I figured one of the oil pressure valves controlling that head had worn and was not holding pressure causing the rattle. I ordered Ebay valves, an OEM gasket and some intake manifold gaskets and did change out those valves to be sure.
The valves are in the valley under the intake manifold.
New one vs old one. I couldn't really see what was wrong with the old one. It wasn't stuck and o-rings were intact, but maybe it was just generally worn.
Side view. Notice the difference in thread count and taper.
The cover was bad as you can see. Ditto for the gasket
The underside of the gasket was ok.
New gasket fitted after installing the valves (20Nm). Cleaned the mating area thoroughly.
Cleaned up the cover.
Cleaned this pipe, part of EGR system, inside was pretty dirty.
It just pushes into that hole and is secured via a bracket
Cover going back on (bolts 10Nm). Clean the bolts good as the oil reaches them.
The intake ports are still nice and clean.
Here is the part number.
I would advise anyone doing cam tensioners to include this job at the same time. The gasket isn't cheap unfortunately. It took about 2hrs to complete.
Now the outcome of this is that I do see a notable difference in the startup noise. It is still kind of there but much more passive. I suspect that the chain has possibly stretched because I can hear the noise faintly with a stethoscope in that area of the valve cover somewhat at 900-1100 rpm. Above/below that it sounds normal. The other bank is completely fine. When the car heats up fully you don't hear anything and it runs normal with confident power. I haven't dropped the oil yet to see if there are signs of metal there.
Not sure what my next steps are yet. Maybe I'll just try to wait it out until I do the timing and change the chain then (35000km away). Its possible that the cam sprocket may have more damage, further complicating things and increasing the cost of the job.
A low mile 2011 D4 just popped on my radar that is priced right, I may decide to take the leap and let this one go.
Its been ~16,000km since doing the tensioner job. Late last year the car started to make a rattling start up noise again but this time it sounded more like a loose internal exhaust component that would fix itself very shortly after 20 seconds or so of the engine running. The car ran fine after startup and no additional noise was heard, full of power etc. Stethoscope probing didn't clearly help identify what the source of the noise was either as it was too short to catch. I was gifted a bore scope and used it inside the drivers valve cover and was able to see some damage to the cam sprocket.
As these are oil pressure driven tensioners, I figured one of the oil pressure valves controlling that head had worn and was not holding pressure causing the rattle. I ordered Ebay valves, an OEM gasket and some intake manifold gaskets and did change out those valves to be sure.
The valves are in the valley under the intake manifold.
New one vs old one. I couldn't really see what was wrong with the old one. It wasn't stuck and o-rings were intact, but maybe it was just generally worn.
Side view. Notice the difference in thread count and taper.
The cover was bad as you can see. Ditto for the gasket
The underside of the gasket was ok.
New gasket fitted after installing the valves (20Nm). Cleaned the mating area thoroughly.
Cleaned up the cover.
Cleaned this pipe, part of EGR system, inside was pretty dirty.
It just pushes into that hole and is secured via a bracket
Cover going back on (bolts 10Nm). Clean the bolts good as the oil reaches them.
The intake ports are still nice and clean.
Here is the part number.
I would advise anyone doing cam tensioners to include this job at the same time. The gasket isn't cheap unfortunately. It took about 2hrs to complete.
Now the outcome of this is that I do see a notable difference in the startup noise. It is still kind of there but much more passive. I suspect that the chain has possibly stretched because I can hear the noise faintly with a stethoscope in that area of the valve cover somewhat at 900-1100 rpm. Above/below that it sounds normal. The other bank is completely fine. When the car heats up fully you don't hear anything and it runs normal with confident power. I haven't dropped the oil yet to see if there are signs of metal there.
Not sure what my next steps are yet. Maybe I'll just try to wait it out until I do the timing and change the chain then (35000km away). Its possible that the cam sprocket may have more damage, further complicating things and increasing the cost of the job.
A low mile 2011 D4 just popped on my radar that is priced right, I may decide to take the leap and let this one go.
Hope someone finds this helpful.
Good job. Can you put the reference of the gasket where the valves go? Thank you
Impressive job, AEightSIlver, and well-detailed, Looking back now after doing all of this work, how much of the startup noise was being caused by the cam tensioner, and how much was being caused by the oil pressure check valves? It seems like it might have been both to some degree.
Its all related at the age of the car. In hindsight I would have done the check valves first as it is the simpler, less costly thing to do. Its hard to say which one would have had more impact but in both cases there was a noticeable difference. The characteristics of the startup noise changed significantly with each repair. At this point I still have something intermittent going on at startup on the drivers side which I suspect is a slightly stretched chain or the new tensioner is defective somehow and still not always holding oil pressure. Tiny rattle almost like a woodpecker tapping metal rapidly. I went on a long drive on the weekend and parked with the nose downhill (not steep) and an hour later it started with a slight noise. But when I started it to leave home initially, no noise. To have changed the chain it would have been a complete timing job basically. @dvs_dave was probably right in the beginning with his suggestion about living with the noise and waiting for codes before doing anything further, but it was loud enough and long enough to worry me. And as this thread shows, the work was justified given the condition of the parts even if it was done earlier than it could have been.
Unfortunately these cars are not worth much on the market so if I hadn't put in my own sweat equity it would not make sense to undertake any of this and move on. They also probably won't appreciate in value anytime soon either if at all. I love my car and its held up well in the northern winters with minimal aluminum corrosion. I've had it since Jan 2016 and my TCO (not including fuel but including purchase cost, all maintenance and repairs, and insurance etc) works out to be $527.01/month CAD on the button taxes included lifetime. What could I get today for that? I put ~10k km a year on it and just drive it in comfort without worry. Currently besides that startup noise, my gas tank release is iffy and I need to manually open it sometimes, trunk motor is gone, the rear trim that holds the handle and reverse lights is starting to corrode (I did clean it up already and painted it), and I'm just beginning to get a whine from the rear at certain speeds (seems like rear right wheel bearing), and I have a cooling fan controller code but the car isn't bothered by it. I can fix all of that (at what cost?) and I feel like it will keep on rolling but its almost 20 years old at this point. I'm probably due for an air strut to go out and timing work will be due relatively soon. Parts are getting more difficult to find and are more costly. There are examples like @Veikra has and in Europe that prove this platform can run for many hundreds of thousands of miles if you want them to. Thank goodness all the service and SSP material exists so you can learn everything about these cars and for these forums.
Point being as these cars age out, you will fight an uphill battle and need to spend some money and your time to keep them going in tip top shape. And with that said, what are you going to replace it with anyway? That's probably my biggest dilemma.
I totally get it and am in the same dilemma. I've had this car for 15 years, and in that time I have spent an average $408 a month, all in, for the car, purchase price plus tax and all maintenance and parts. I do as much work as I can myself but for some items I depend on the indy. Agreed on the value, and if you aren't a DIY at some level, you would have sold this car long ago. I've passed the 100K miles hump with all of the little break-fix issues like door handles, PCV valve, coils, plugs, all vacuum lines, trunk motor, brake light switch, alarm siren, torque mount etc. etc. But no one in town has a car like this one, so it's a one-of-a-kind, which I like. I just replaced the red plastic spark plug conduits (sourced from Slovakia - not available in US any more) and the engine compartment looks great. And it rides so nice, every time I get in and start it up and drive it, I ask myself why would I ever want to get rid of this car? It's one of the nicest cars I've ever owned, and it's probably running better than it has in many years. A new car will cost thousands. Plus I know the car and its service history in complete detail. And insurance is cheap. So I basically feel like I'll drive it until it develops some kind of fatal problem that is obviously not worth repairing, and that will be it.
I've done most of the common maintenance items on this car except the tensioners. I have the standard rattle at startup. No codes, just the rattle, mostly on the driver side. I replaced both tensioner gaskets a while back along with cam plugs to fix some oil leaks. I should have bit the bullet and replaced the tensioners then. I've got Motul oil and a quart of Rislone in there to quiet the valve clatter. Other than the 2 second rattle at startup, it runs like a dream. So I have adopted dvs_dave's recommendation, wait until there are codes. Maybe I'll replace the check valves and see what happens. I've recently found that some indys won't even do the tensioner work because of "liability" issues - they say the car is too old. So who knows, I may end up in there myself, doing that at some point.
06-28-2023, 03:32 PM
