Transmission questions
01-07-2005, 02:53 PM
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Transmission questions
<center><img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/85631/steves_05_a8l.jpg"></center><p>ok, everything I read about the car says the tranny is: smooth or seamless, inutitive, silky, etc. My 05 A8L (2000 miles) is anything but smooth, especially when cold in the regular setting..rapidly shifts thru 1,2,3 with a lag between gears..is that normal..it is much smoother but hardly "seamless" when warm. Sport mode is way better..is this just the adaptive trans. geting used to my driving or should I have the guys check it out @5K miles when 1st service is due? Otherwise I'm delighted with the car.
01-07-2005, 07:41 PM
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Here's what I "heard" on the internets...
The following was copied from two posts on another Audi A8/Phaeton Forum:
#1. "I just want to let you know I again talked with a master phaeton tech today and he is also unhappy with these transmission problems. He claims every one he has worked or driven has this same problem and vw considers it normal even though they are working on a software upgrade to solve it. He told me to drive in sport to cure the problem. I also went to the san jose auto show and talked with a marketing person for vw and she told me that the 2005.5 will have a dvd navigation and blue tooth compatibility. She also told me that I should always be driving a phaeton or toureg when my car is in the shop."
#2. "The Audi folks also consider the tiptronic lag (and to a lesser extent the DBW lag) to be "as it was designed" (or normal as you were told.)
There are many (200?) programs built into the tiptronic (and remember several auto mfg's source tip or at least tip-like manumatics from the same manufacturer -- although I am led to conclude that the actual software is created [tweaked, perhaps?] by the end manufacturer) and these programs attempt to account for many kinds of driving styles. But even though the transmission is said to be a learning transmission, I cannot imagine anyone bold enough to currently call the transmission "AI" (artificial intelligence.)
Each addition of another gear, another shift program and other tricks to make the shifts less perceptible seems to improve, slightly, the lag issue. It does appear that the "S" as in S6, S8, or RS6 program cars have "crisper" up shifts and, IMO, THAT is the primary reason for the substantially reduced tip lag in these cars.
Putting the selector in "S" (sport) mode seems to override the relentless pursuit of the next higher gear, sooner rather than later -- but at the cost of: #1 slightly decreased fuel economy; & #2 slightly increased "shift perception."
The fact that the VW group "claims" to be aware of this "feature" of the tiptronic, I take as a good sign. However, the fact that this has been the case since 1997 (or at least that is when I first noticed it), does not make me sanguine for a quick resolution.
My preference would be VAG offering a 6 speed manual (like the current S4 has in it.)
I suspect some would balk at the notion of a Phaeton or Audi A8 with a clutch pedal, but I think the things would have a waiting line for buyers (due perhaps, I'll admit, to the novelty aspect, but nevertheless a line.)
It has NOT been all that long ago that the flagship cars from Audi and BMW offered manual transmissions -- and interesting to note that the CTS-V Cadillac comes with a stick shift.
Not too many years ago, I was in Munich and rented a "big" Mercedes (I can't remember the designation or model name/number) -- I got in it and noted it was a stick shift; ditto with European rental BMW's and Audi's (but I know that the big top 'o the line cars now are only auto -- and more's the pity.)
For $50 to $100,000 cars to have such funky (automatic) transmissions is disappointing, to say the least."
#1. "I just want to let you know I again talked with a master phaeton tech today and he is also unhappy with these transmission problems. He claims every one he has worked or driven has this same problem and vw considers it normal even though they are working on a software upgrade to solve it. He told me to drive in sport to cure the problem. I also went to the san jose auto show and talked with a marketing person for vw and she told me that the 2005.5 will have a dvd navigation and blue tooth compatibility. She also told me that I should always be driving a phaeton or toureg when my car is in the shop."
#2. "The Audi folks also consider the tiptronic lag (and to a lesser extent the DBW lag) to be "as it was designed" (or normal as you were told.)
There are many (200?) programs built into the tiptronic (and remember several auto mfg's source tip or at least tip-like manumatics from the same manufacturer -- although I am led to conclude that the actual software is created [tweaked, perhaps?] by the end manufacturer) and these programs attempt to account for many kinds of driving styles. But even though the transmission is said to be a learning transmission, I cannot imagine anyone bold enough to currently call the transmission "AI" (artificial intelligence.)
Each addition of another gear, another shift program and other tricks to make the shifts less perceptible seems to improve, slightly, the lag issue. It does appear that the "S" as in S6, S8, or RS6 program cars have "crisper" up shifts and, IMO, THAT is the primary reason for the substantially reduced tip lag in these cars.
Putting the selector in "S" (sport) mode seems to override the relentless pursuit of the next higher gear, sooner rather than later -- but at the cost of: #1 slightly decreased fuel economy; & #2 slightly increased "shift perception."
The fact that the VW group "claims" to be aware of this "feature" of the tiptronic, I take as a good sign. However, the fact that this has been the case since 1997 (or at least that is when I first noticed it), does not make me sanguine for a quick resolution.
My preference would be VAG offering a 6 speed manual (like the current S4 has in it.)
I suspect some would balk at the notion of a Phaeton or Audi A8 with a clutch pedal, but I think the things would have a waiting line for buyers (due perhaps, I'll admit, to the novelty aspect, but nevertheless a line.)
It has NOT been all that long ago that the flagship cars from Audi and BMW offered manual transmissions -- and interesting to note that the CTS-V Cadillac comes with a stick shift.
Not too many years ago, I was in Munich and rented a "big" Mercedes (I can't remember the designation or model name/number) -- I got in it and noted it was a stick shift; ditto with European rental BMW's and Audi's (but I know that the big top 'o the line cars now are only auto -- and more's the pity.)
For $50 to $100,000 cars to have such funky (automatic) transmissions is disappointing, to say the least."
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01-08-2005, 07:01 AM
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Re: The was last sentence was part of the article...
<ul><li><a href="http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/WebX?14@55.iaaUclwcMjS.4@.ef08c89/1223">http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/WebX?14@55.iaaUclwcMjS.4@.ef08c89/1223</a</li></ul>
01-08-2005, 07:59 AM
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Re: FWIW, the tip in the B6 S4 is very smooth.
at least I'm not losing my mind...I assumed the 6 speed just had different shift ponits than the 5 speed (sport mode) which of course it does. Coming from a 740 iL (5 speed auto) I jusy figures I wasn;t used to the different program...but the 6 even "behaves" differently than the 5 speed...guess I'll be a sport mode guy until I reach cruisng speed...or just tip it myself..still a great ride..:-)