Question about Color and Leather Option
01-16-2011, 06:58 PM
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Question about Color and Leather Option
I'm just starting the process of convincing myself to get the 2011 D4 A8 (not A8L). I have 2 questions - one relating to color, and the other relating to a feature of the design of the leather seats.
My local dealers do not have the Emerald Black, and I'm wondering if anyone has seen it in person and has comments good or bad? (My dealers have the little 6 inch color swatch, but that's useless for a determining subtle hued colors. I'm curious if the Emerald Black makes the car looks muddy or muted out, or if the 'emerald' hues actually shine a bit. I presume that it is definitely more black green, but is the green even visible?
I have seen the Havana Black and I don't like the brown hue because to me it makes the car look dull -- classy, but dull.
Also, does anyone know what option to select to get the 'cross hatch' looking leather inserts in the seats (driver and passenger front/back) That feature makes the seating look very Bentley-esque. Interior shots on the UK Audi website show the A8 with these type of seats, but the US website does not. I've seen a few dealers with online listings that have 2011 A8s with this feature - I saw one in nougat in one in beige. But local dealers don't have them, and local sales guys are completely clueless as to what this is or what the code is. Any help would be appreciated.
PS- as an aside, it is shocking to me that people can work at an upscale car dealer like Audi, and their sole job duties are to know everything about these cars, yet they are still amazingly clueless. It's like they sit around all day with their thumbs up their collective a*ses.
My local dealers do not have the Emerald Black, and I'm wondering if anyone has seen it in person and has comments good or bad? (My dealers have the little 6 inch color swatch, but that's useless for a determining subtle hued colors. I'm curious if the Emerald Black makes the car looks muddy or muted out, or if the 'emerald' hues actually shine a bit. I presume that it is definitely more black green, but is the green even visible?
I have seen the Havana Black and I don't like the brown hue because to me it makes the car look dull -- classy, but dull.
Also, does anyone know what option to select to get the 'cross hatch' looking leather inserts in the seats (driver and passenger front/back) That feature makes the seating look very Bentley-esque. Interior shots on the UK Audi website show the A8 with these type of seats, but the US website does not. I've seen a few dealers with online listings that have 2011 A8s with this feature - I saw one in nougat in one in beige. But local dealers don't have them, and local sales guys are completely clueless as to what this is or what the code is. Any help would be appreciated.
PS- as an aside, it is shocking to me that people can work at an upscale car dealer like Audi, and their sole job duties are to know everything about these cars, yet they are still amazingly clueless. It's like they sit around all day with their thumbs up their collective a*ses.
01-17-2011, 07:09 AM
#2
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My impression of the Havanna and Emerald Black (metallic) colors is also from the sample paint chips. Having said that, yes, they probably aren't as crisp or deep as one would experience with say Brilliant Black, however, they appear to have a very reflective impact in sunlight---Havanna setting off brown tints/hues, while Emerald with dark green hues. I now have Phantom Black, and that color also doesn't generally appear as crisp as Brilliant Black. My wife and I like the Porsche Cobalt Grey very much (Grey with a brownish tint in it in sunlight), and the Havanna Black comes fairly close, albeit darker. You want to see a real muddy color in direct sunlight?---look at the Oolong Grey. It's great looking inside the showroom, but takes on a muddied Khakki (sp?) hue in the sunlight.
As for the seats you mention, they are exclusive to the Sport Package here in North America. No ordering availability outside the sport package.
A comment re: your dissatisfaction with the lack of knowledge on the part of Audi dealers---this entire A8 launch by Audi of America has been a royal screw-up (an opinion shared with my dealer's personnel), which has also left dealers out of the info loop on many fronts:
1-The info presented to all the U.S. dealers early on was not completely accurate on some fronts (remember the issue of the power closing doors for the NWB car?---first was detailed in dealer product info as going to be included in an option package, then at port training when demo cars arrived, dealers told it's not available for ordering at all, and a few weeks later the power closing doors are finally made a stand-alone option;
2-Audi launched the A8 with only one NWB demo car per dealer;
3-No A8L cars until late November, and then only one car per dealer---and those cars arrived at U.S. dealers decontented without the standard leather package, which the dealers were not informed about until weeks later (I was told by AoA this happened due to short supply of material!!!);
4-The demo cars show up in the same color for mostly all locations---Phantom Black w/Nugat interior in NWB cars, and Oolong Grey w/Black interior for the A8L cars.
5-Early product info in brochures showed, in some pictures, the A8 wearing the 19-inch 5-spoke twist rims that were available on D3 A8s from 2008 thru 2010---and these wheels are shown on the German website for the D4. In fact, the D4 owner's manual shows these wheels on the cover, but they are not available in the U.S. at all---I tried to get AoA to allow me to order them in place of the standard 10-spoke "Y" 19-inch rims, but after a long back-and-forth, the only way to order them was with a $2,400 surcharge, which was a total rip-off since I could order them from my dealer at the same price and still have the original wheels the car came with!
6-After customer orders were taken, AoA quietly informs dealers that front fog lights are not available for the standard xenon headlamp clusters.
7-A8L "sold order" customer cars ordered with the Rear Seat Comfort Package arrive at port without the rear ventilated seats, which were supposed to be part of this option package. A few days later AoA informs dealers that the Rear Comfort Package no longer includes the ventilated seats---only available as part of Executive Rear Seat Package.
8-The "official" A8 sales brochure that was released in November/December was also inaccurate on a few issues---shows the Extended Leather Package as an option on both A8 and A8L, when it's standard on the "L"; is incorrect on the 20" tire size, listing it as 255X35 when it's actually 265X40.
9-Delayed availability of the google maps feature for the nav system. Last I heard from my dealer is that it will appear in late Spring production cars.
So, my feeling is that Audi's U.S. dealer network has also been left in the dark to a fairly large degree on this flagship launch. Think of it, Audi had a full year to get things in line for their A8 launch in North America, and they've screwed it up from day-1. Now add to the mix the rumors (which are probably accurate) that the 372-hp 4.2 V8 will be replaced for the 2012 MY with a forced induction 400+ hp 4.0 V8---think of it a new engine in this new model's 2nd year!
The net result of all this is that I had an order slated to go into production the week of Jan 30th, but I cancelled it last week. I'd rather wait and place an order for a 2012 when all the "launch dust" settles.
As for the seats you mention, they are exclusive to the Sport Package here in North America. No ordering availability outside the sport package.
A comment re: your dissatisfaction with the lack of knowledge on the part of Audi dealers---this entire A8 launch by Audi of America has been a royal screw-up (an opinion shared with my dealer's personnel), which has also left dealers out of the info loop on many fronts:
1-The info presented to all the U.S. dealers early on was not completely accurate on some fronts (remember the issue of the power closing doors for the NWB car?---first was detailed in dealer product info as going to be included in an option package, then at port training when demo cars arrived, dealers told it's not available for ordering at all, and a few weeks later the power closing doors are finally made a stand-alone option;
2-Audi launched the A8 with only one NWB demo car per dealer;
3-No A8L cars until late November, and then only one car per dealer---and those cars arrived at U.S. dealers decontented without the standard leather package, which the dealers were not informed about until weeks later (I was told by AoA this happened due to short supply of material!!!);
4-The demo cars show up in the same color for mostly all locations---Phantom Black w/Nugat interior in NWB cars, and Oolong Grey w/Black interior for the A8L cars.
5-Early product info in brochures showed, in some pictures, the A8 wearing the 19-inch 5-spoke twist rims that were available on D3 A8s from 2008 thru 2010---and these wheels are shown on the German website for the D4. In fact, the D4 owner's manual shows these wheels on the cover, but they are not available in the U.S. at all---I tried to get AoA to allow me to order them in place of the standard 10-spoke "Y" 19-inch rims, but after a long back-and-forth, the only way to order them was with a $2,400 surcharge, which was a total rip-off since I could order them from my dealer at the same price and still have the original wheels the car came with!
6-After customer orders were taken, AoA quietly informs dealers that front fog lights are not available for the standard xenon headlamp clusters.
7-A8L "sold order" customer cars ordered with the Rear Seat Comfort Package arrive at port without the rear ventilated seats, which were supposed to be part of this option package. A few days later AoA informs dealers that the Rear Comfort Package no longer includes the ventilated seats---only available as part of Executive Rear Seat Package.
8-The "official" A8 sales brochure that was released in November/December was also inaccurate on a few issues---shows the Extended Leather Package as an option on both A8 and A8L, when it's standard on the "L"; is incorrect on the 20" tire size, listing it as 255X35 when it's actually 265X40.
9-Delayed availability of the google maps feature for the nav system. Last I heard from my dealer is that it will appear in late Spring production cars.
So, my feeling is that Audi's U.S. dealer network has also been left in the dark to a fairly large degree on this flagship launch. Think of it, Audi had a full year to get things in line for their A8 launch in North America, and they've screwed it up from day-1. Now add to the mix the rumors (which are probably accurate) that the 372-hp 4.2 V8 will be replaced for the 2012 MY with a forced induction 400+ hp 4.0 V8---think of it a new engine in this new model's 2nd year!
The net result of all this is that I had an order slated to go into production the week of Jan 30th, but I cancelled it last week. I'd rather wait and place an order for a 2012 when all the "launch dust" settles.
Last edited by derfA8L; 01-17-2011 at 07:16 AM.
01-17-2011, 07:31 AM
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As ever, derfA8L observations are most helpful.
Given the technical glitches with the D3 launch I expected that there would be a few such problems with the first model year D4, including the real potential fro a more powerful and in this case more fuel efficient engine for the D4's second model year, but I must say that the problems that you enumerated above go beyond what I expected. Very un-Teutonic I would say. Such magnificent design and engineering demands much better implementation for the dealers and buyers.
Is it me or has this forum gotten relatively inactive, especially since the D4 was introduced officially? My recollection is that the forum was very active a few years ago and more. Nevertheless, it has been very helpful to me.
FWIW, my 08 A8 sport optioned car is absolutely the best that I have ever owned and that includes quite a few high-end MB's, BMW's Porsches and Audis in the past ten years, which is one reason that I am entirely comfortable keeping it until Audi sorts out the D4. The D4 S8 is likely to be a quantum leap above former S variants and if they can keep the pricing competitive, it should be an admittedly different, but nonetheless more attractive alternative to those of us considering the Panamera 4S or a used Pan Turbo.
Given the technical glitches with the D3 launch I expected that there would be a few such problems with the first model year D4, including the real potential fro a more powerful and in this case more fuel efficient engine for the D4's second model year, but I must say that the problems that you enumerated above go beyond what I expected. Very un-Teutonic I would say. Such magnificent design and engineering demands much better implementation for the dealers and buyers.
Is it me or has this forum gotten relatively inactive, especially since the D4 was introduced officially? My recollection is that the forum was very active a few years ago and more. Nevertheless, it has been very helpful to me.
FWIW, my 08 A8 sport optioned car is absolutely the best that I have ever owned and that includes quite a few high-end MB's, BMW's Porsches and Audis in the past ten years, which is one reason that I am entirely comfortable keeping it until Audi sorts out the D4. The D4 S8 is likely to be a quantum leap above former S variants and if they can keep the pricing competitive, it should be an admittedly different, but nonetheless more attractive alternative to those of us considering the Panamera 4S or a used Pan Turbo.
01-17-2011, 09:05 AM
#4
AudiWorld Super User
Derf, do you think Audi couldn't get their forced induction V8 ready for the cars launch in 2011? It just seems like their launch has been totally botched. I think I am going to wait until 2013 to make any sort of move on a D4 I want them to sort out options features etc. It seems like such a mess.
01-17-2011, 09:56 AM
#5
AudiWorld Super User
Derf, do you think Audi couldn't get their forced induction V8 ready for the cars launch in 2011? It just seems like their launch has been totally botched. I think I am going to wait until 2013 to make any sort of move on a D4 I want them to sort out options features etc. It seems like such a mess.
01-17-2011, 10:19 AM
#6
AudiWorld Senior Member
Interesting commentary... After having a number of A6s over the last 10 years, my Wife and I looked briefly at an A8 last February. However, with the new model launch we elected to wait and instead purchased a Lexus LS460 AWD. I knew I was going to regret the choice and within a month I was kicking myself. While the car is wonderfully engineered the best analogy I can make is that its like driving a coffin... So this weekend went out for a look-see at the new A8.
First stop was to drive a 750ix for a frame of reference. Dealer was helpful, nice inventory selection, color combos abound and even talked about European delivery. All in all left the dealership thinking that I could be happy with a 750. However, my heart was still with Audi.
Next stop was at Audi and said we were interested in an A8. This was immediately met with disappointment by the dealer as they have limited inventory. They had no interest in looking at other dealers inventory and even less interest in ordering one. I felt that if I didn't like one of the 2 cars on the lot then I'm out of luck. I asked about European delivery and he gave me a brochure, but said he knew very little about it. I then asked about Google Earth integration and was asked "Google, what?". We were not even offered a test drive.
For right now stay pat with the Lexus and might venture out again in summer as inventory builds up.
First stop was to drive a 750ix for a frame of reference. Dealer was helpful, nice inventory selection, color combos abound and even talked about European delivery. All in all left the dealership thinking that I could be happy with a 750. However, my heart was still with Audi.
Next stop was at Audi and said we were interested in an A8. This was immediately met with disappointment by the dealer as they have limited inventory. They had no interest in looking at other dealers inventory and even less interest in ordering one. I felt that if I didn't like one of the 2 cars on the lot then I'm out of luck. I asked about European delivery and he gave me a brochure, but said he knew very little about it. I then asked about Google Earth integration and was asked "Google, what?". We were not even offered a test drive.
For right now stay pat with the Lexus and might venture out again in summer as inventory builds up.
01-17-2011, 12:37 PM
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[QUOTE=chicagoA6;24091573]Interesting commentary...
Sorry to hear about all the negative experiences -either with the car or dealers. I also remember a more active online participation in the past -and relatively fewer bad dealer experiences. I have always known that the online community is only @ 10% of owners - it would be nice to hear from the many more out there. At any rate, I know they are selling well in Europe and here in the Southwest - a very large selection at the Scottsdale (Penske owned) place and they are selling several a week. I usually don't like to 'market' dealers, but they have been terrific w/ everything - from info to providing a free Audicare program - so perhaps it's worth a fly out to Scottsdale for some of you, and see the Barrett/Jackson auction too! So far, no complaints w/ my demo I paid cash for to get the best deal (a NWB phantom black/black interior - which has been rare for demos). My 2 complaints with my 07 was the 6 speed 'searching for gears' tran and the (record) 4 replacements of B&O pop up speakers. Solved! We really love this car and the hp is just fine w/ the new 8 speed. As for better mileage, it's difficult to say, but I can't believe the 2012 engine will be that much greater - and if any of you are like me driving mostly in 's' mode, then frequent fill-ups should be budgeted for. Yes, several things have been changed/removed (ticket holder; tpms, etc) and others, frustratingly, remain (shallow cupholders, too many sticks on the column, etc.) but it is really a great drive/ride so don't let the mediocrity of salespeople or Audi corporate confusion keep you away.
Sorry to hear about all the negative experiences -either with the car or dealers. I also remember a more active online participation in the past -and relatively fewer bad dealer experiences. I have always known that the online community is only @ 10% of owners - it would be nice to hear from the many more out there. At any rate, I know they are selling well in Europe and here in the Southwest - a very large selection at the Scottsdale (Penske owned) place and they are selling several a week. I usually don't like to 'market' dealers, but they have been terrific w/ everything - from info to providing a free Audicare program - so perhaps it's worth a fly out to Scottsdale for some of you, and see the Barrett/Jackson auction too! So far, no complaints w/ my demo I paid cash for to get the best deal (a NWB phantom black/black interior - which has been rare for demos). My 2 complaints with my 07 was the 6 speed 'searching for gears' tran and the (record) 4 replacements of B&O pop up speakers. Solved! We really love this car and the hp is just fine w/ the new 8 speed. As for better mileage, it's difficult to say, but I can't believe the 2012 engine will be that much greater - and if any of you are like me driving mostly in 's' mode, then frequent fill-ups should be budgeted for. Yes, several things have been changed/removed (ticket holder; tpms, etc) and others, frustratingly, remain (shallow cupholders, too many sticks on the column, etc.) but it is really a great drive/ride so don't let the mediocrity of salespeople or Audi corporate confusion keep you away.
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01-17-2011, 01:07 PM
#8
AudiWorld Super User
Yea Snow is correct...the D4, despite the faulty U.S. model launch, is one terrific ride. For anyone on the fence who doesn't care about the google map and potential engine issue, go test drive one---try it out with the steering and suspension set to dynamic mode and I think you'll be impressed.
For me, it was a long and hard decision to cancel our D4 order when so close to getting it, but it would weigh on my mind that they changed the engine 6-months after I took delivery---even though I probably might prefer the normally aspirated 4.2 engine over a forced induction setup.
For me, it was a long and hard decision to cancel our D4 order when so close to getting it, but it would weigh on my mind that they changed the engine 6-months after I took delivery---even though I probably might prefer the normally aspirated 4.2 engine over a forced induction setup.
01-17-2011, 01:39 PM
#9
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Derf, do you think Audi couldn't get their forced induction V8 ready for the cars launch in 2011? It just seems like their launch has been totally botched. I think I am going to wait until 2013 to make any sort of move on a D4 I want them to sort out options features etc. It seems like such a mess.
01-17-2011, 02:04 PM
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Thanks guys.
I'm anxious to get back into Audi, but these new engine rumors for 2012 make me aprehensive, as well as waiting to see what the new S8 will bring.
I'm also interested to find out how the new A7 drives, and in that vein, the new MB CLS. I saw a fully complete 2012 CLS test car a couple of months back sneaking around in my area, and it is very nice looking and somewhat larger than the prior version. Granted, it is not the size of an A8, but if MB steps up its game with the interior of this car, it may just tempt me enough.
My BMW 750i is driving me crazy. Way too much torque, not enough grip and a bitchy traction control system. This is a 400+ HP car, and frankly the power is just over the top, which is why I'm thinking I may be ok with the current 2011 A8 engine. While driving the BMW in the city, you can't even use half that horsepower, and on top of it the turbo lag is evident when you need to get out of tricky situations (either that or the traction control is preventing the power from going down). I test drove an S-Class again a month ago, maybe thinking that could work out, but I just can't see why anyone under the age of 70 (or a pimp) would buy an S-Class. It's heavy, can't handle in the same class as a 750 or A8, the interior is yesterday's news and it's a $10k+ premium over the other 2. The BMW is leaps and bounds better than an S-Class, including the interior, but in practical terms, I think the A8 is an all around better car than both.
I'm anxious to get back into Audi, but these new engine rumors for 2012 make me aprehensive, as well as waiting to see what the new S8 will bring.
I'm also interested to find out how the new A7 drives, and in that vein, the new MB CLS. I saw a fully complete 2012 CLS test car a couple of months back sneaking around in my area, and it is very nice looking and somewhat larger than the prior version. Granted, it is not the size of an A8, but if MB steps up its game with the interior of this car, it may just tempt me enough.
My BMW 750i is driving me crazy. Way too much torque, not enough grip and a bitchy traction control system. This is a 400+ HP car, and frankly the power is just over the top, which is why I'm thinking I may be ok with the current 2011 A8 engine. While driving the BMW in the city, you can't even use half that horsepower, and on top of it the turbo lag is evident when you need to get out of tricky situations (either that or the traction control is preventing the power from going down). I test drove an S-Class again a month ago, maybe thinking that could work out, but I just can't see why anyone under the age of 70 (or a pimp) would buy an S-Class. It's heavy, can't handle in the same class as a 750 or A8, the interior is yesterday's news and it's a $10k+ premium over the other 2. The BMW is leaps and bounds better than an S-Class, including the interior, but in practical terms, I think the A8 is an all around better car than both.