I HATE COPS...........................(long sorry)
04-05-2004, 09:14 AM
#21
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mistakes...and why i like lasers
with a laser SMD (speed measuring device) he could easily pick out your car from that distance...laser is NOT like radar, where the beam disperses greatly the farther it gets away from the device. you point it at the target and squeeze the triger, bam...done. no delay like radar. if he pointed the SMD at you and pulled the trigger, he got you. unless the device had been abused, and they rarely are, he got you. plain and simple.
As for guilt, in most states speeding isn;t a crime, it's an infraction and guilt does NOT have to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
As for his disrespect, an trooper in the seattle area writes about 10 tickets in an average day, 9 of those people will argue that they didn't do anything wrong, call him all sorts of names, question his parentage....why the hell should he take YOUR word for something he's been trained to do? Do you think he made it up? risked his career and pension to write YOU a ticket? it doesn't work like that.
Ron's Rule for dealing with cops #223 - Don't EVER argue with the cop on the side of the road....if you really think you didn't commit the infraction, take it to court...don't argue with the cop. Don't argue with the cop. the cop? Don't argue with him.
As for guilt, in most states speeding isn;t a crime, it's an infraction and guilt does NOT have to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
As for his disrespect, an trooper in the seattle area writes about 10 tickets in an average day, 9 of those people will argue that they didn't do anything wrong, call him all sorts of names, question his parentage....why the hell should he take YOUR word for something he's been trained to do? Do you think he made it up? risked his career and pension to write YOU a ticket? it doesn't work like that.
Ron's Rule for dealing with cops #223 - Don't EVER argue with the cop on the side of the road....if you really think you didn't commit the infraction, take it to court...don't argue with the cop. Don't argue with the cop. the cop? Don't argue with him.
04-05-2004, 09:27 AM
#22
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More to it than that..
Ron, I respect your analogy, regarding attitude and hostility, but I fail to see the relevancy. Most public sector employees have a very comprehensive interaction with John Q, albeit, some more than others. Everyone loves garbagemen....hell they clean up our mess and make our lives somewhat more tolerable. We all love them, they are great guys/gals!! Man, those fellas who tear up the roads all summer long, only to re-pave them, blocking traffic for miles...I hate them at the time. But when they are done, I love them for the sacrificial laying of that beautiful black top. It makes my commute for the other 10.5 months of the year much more tolerable. I use that word again, tolerable. Hauling a driver over with out of state tags to issue a noise violation because he might have rolled a stop sign is bullsh-t. Not tolerable at all. Pretext stops are, absolutely, one of the most misused facets a cop can use. Civil rights my ***. We have the right to cooperate with the `big boss man' `cause he packin' and said so. Does that matter tho, when a cop might be able to pull a few hours of overtime because he is required to go to court? You said it.
I can only imagine the apprehension a cop must feel when, during a traffic stop in a remote area at night, he approaches a vehicle. Who is behind the wheel, is there drugs in the car, weapons? But then again, how does the driver feel? I know how I feel, attitude and hostility. I have been driving for 23 years now and, in that time, have received 4 tickets. I remember them all, I was guilty for all of them and I paid every ticket without hesitation. Saying that, I must have been hauled over at least 50 times in that 23 years. The most recent one was to comment on the shape of my coupe and the fact that I was travelling 102 kms per hour in a 100 km zone!!! The pretext stop was due to the fact I was travelling 2 kms over. That's 1.25 miles per hour over! That's about the width of a hair on my speedometer. The real reason he pulled me over was he wanted to talk about my sled. I don't know. Doesn't make sense to me. Doesn't make me tolerate them more. I would like to think my tax dollars are better spent supporting a police force that solves crimes.
So Ron, trying to justify a cops actions to most people is futile. We all love our freedom and all that goes with it. Understandably, there is a price for that. But I would have to say that issuing a summons to a person because he/she got all pissy is completely offside, unprofessional and that analogy totally supports my argument against pretext stops and the misuse of authority many cops employ on a daily basis.
To theaudiguy, fight it man. Don't lay down on this one.
I can only imagine the apprehension a cop must feel when, during a traffic stop in a remote area at night, he approaches a vehicle. Who is behind the wheel, is there drugs in the car, weapons? But then again, how does the driver feel? I know how I feel, attitude and hostility. I have been driving for 23 years now and, in that time, have received 4 tickets. I remember them all, I was guilty for all of them and I paid every ticket without hesitation. Saying that, I must have been hauled over at least 50 times in that 23 years. The most recent one was to comment on the shape of my coupe and the fact that I was travelling 102 kms per hour in a 100 km zone!!! The pretext stop was due to the fact I was travelling 2 kms over. That's 1.25 miles per hour over! That's about the width of a hair on my speedometer. The real reason he pulled me over was he wanted to talk about my sled. I don't know. Doesn't make sense to me. Doesn't make me tolerate them more. I would like to think my tax dollars are better spent supporting a police force that solves crimes.
So Ron, trying to justify a cops actions to most people is futile. We all love our freedom and all that goes with it. Understandably, there is a price for that. But I would have to say that issuing a summons to a person because he/she got all pissy is completely offside, unprofessional and that analogy totally supports my argument against pretext stops and the misuse of authority many cops employ on a daily basis.
To theaudiguy, fight it man. Don't lay down on this one.
04-05-2004, 09:37 AM
#23
Speed is always a factor my friend
Because maintaining control of your car....ie, getting it stopped, making that corner, missing the guy ahead of you, etc. is 100% affected by the speed you're travelling, it's pretty ridiculous to say that "Any idiot with common sense knows it's not.
The faster you go, the more reaction time you need to stop, the greater the stopping distance and on and on. You know that. It's one of the first things taught in driver's Ed.
You can be THE most attentive driver on the road, but if you are going to fast, there's no way you can compensate for the laws of physics that are acting on your vehicle and on you. You know that too.
As for the accuracy of the LASER. Nothing is more accurate. In fact, they have gun sights on them like a rifle with a scope. They only "hit" what's in the cross-hairs. Period.
The system is not rigged against the little guy. You have all sorts of oportunities to contest the citation, and you can even do it in writting.
For example, when you got to court, the officer doesn't get an attorney to assist him in your case. However, you certainly have that option. Also, the burden of proof is on the officer. He has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that A) he has the training to enforce traffic, B) he has the training to use the equipment, C) the equipment was in good condition and properly maintained and used D) That he had reasonable suspicion to believe you were speeding E) it was you that he identified at the speed.
If you truely weren't speeding then contest the ticket. Although, I notice in your statement above, you admit to speeding.....65 in a 60.
And don't think for a minute that any officer is going to stand there on the side of the road and argue the case with you. It's not going to happen because A) It's not safe for either of you B) It's not the proper place or time
The faster you go, the more reaction time you need to stop, the greater the stopping distance and on and on. You know that. It's one of the first things taught in driver's Ed.
You can be THE most attentive driver on the road, but if you are going to fast, there's no way you can compensate for the laws of physics that are acting on your vehicle and on you. You know that too.
As for the accuracy of the LASER. Nothing is more accurate. In fact, they have gun sights on them like a rifle with a scope. They only "hit" what's in the cross-hairs. Period.
The system is not rigged against the little guy. You have all sorts of oportunities to contest the citation, and you can even do it in writting.
For example, when you got to court, the officer doesn't get an attorney to assist him in your case. However, you certainly have that option. Also, the burden of proof is on the officer. He has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that A) he has the training to enforce traffic, B) he has the training to use the equipment, C) the equipment was in good condition and properly maintained and used D) That he had reasonable suspicion to believe you were speeding E) it was you that he identified at the speed.
If you truely weren't speeding then contest the ticket. Although, I notice in your statement above, you admit to speeding.....65 in a 60.
And don't think for a minute that any officer is going to stand there on the side of the road and argue the case with you. It's not going to happen because A) It's not safe for either of you B) It's not the proper place or time
04-05-2004, 09:43 AM
#24
That's quite a different story from the one you posted in the 80/90 forum.
"was out yesterday and a police turns around and puts his lights on a few cars behind me... since i have an expired sticker, loud exhaust, and all my documents got shredded (washing machine) i kinda paniced... my friend is yellin at me to just floor it so i pull behind a gas station..."<ul><li><a href="https://forums.audiworld.com/9080/msgs/166524.phtml">The true story?</a></li></ul>
04-05-2004, 09:43 AM
#25
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yeah....way more....
i'm not saying that you'll get a ticket when you shouldn't (most times) cause you flipped attitude to the cop. you MIGHT, however, get out of one you really deserve by being nice and polite to the cop.
personally i like pretext stops for the same reason i think profiling is just damn fine.
If it's 90 degrees outside and i see a guy wearing a wool overcoat standing outside a 7-11 (where your wife is working the grave shift, say) watching people come and go and when everyone has left he steps inside.....would you rather i have the ability to contact him before he goes inside for loitering, for example, or would you have me wait until he robs the place. (or maybe gets scared away from robbing the place cause a cop just talked to him and asked him why he weas hanging around.)
Freedom ain't free guys (and morgan:-) ((well, and alie too))
you may give up a bit of privacy to a cop sometimes, but it ultimately makes you safer. Cops are human, make mistakes, have bad days, and some.....a very small minority, are on a power trip....are you willing to take away the tools the ones who are doing the right thing use to make you more safe cause of the few bad ones?
personally i like pretext stops for the same reason i think profiling is just damn fine.
If it's 90 degrees outside and i see a guy wearing a wool overcoat standing outside a 7-11 (where your wife is working the grave shift, say) watching people come and go and when everyone has left he steps inside.....would you rather i have the ability to contact him before he goes inside for loitering, for example, or would you have me wait until he robs the place. (or maybe gets scared away from robbing the place cause a cop just talked to him and asked him why he weas hanging around.)
Freedom ain't free guys (and morgan:-) ((well, and alie too))
you may give up a bit of privacy to a cop sometimes, but it ultimately makes you safer. Cops are human, make mistakes, have bad days, and some.....a very small minority, are on a power trip....are you willing to take away the tools the ones who are doing the right thing use to make you more safe cause of the few bad ones?
04-05-2004, 09:56 AM
#28
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ive done a few police ride-alongs.. just in the back seat with cuffs on..
nothing im proud of, but to be honest ive been there. im always a perfect gentleman with the police, but sometimes you do things where i guess they just have to arrest you. or take your car...
04-05-2004, 10:11 AM
#30
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Re: So far I have been lucky to stay out of trouble.........
In high school I used to get busted for doing burnouts in the parking lot a school and racing but never got arrested. The cops in my town got to know me and they would stop me to bust my chops but would usually let me go. I stayed out of trouble and they new I was a gearhead and always saw wrenching around cars since I was a kid. Some of them are into cars and would stop me just to check out the cars. Only trouble I've had with cops is the problems with the EX which I posted about last week, but even that cop called me back telling me he thinks I'm a good kid and maybe this girl is out to get me. There's a fine line between messing around and actually breaking the law. Its good to get in and be friends with your local Police. If they know you, they will be there to help you out in a bad situation.