CGTBrad

mostly because I do 5000 mile oil changes on the Mobil1.

B_WALLACH

I use Amsoil also and have ran Mobil 1 so I can compare them easy enough. The mobile 1 used more oil, wasn't as smooth running and had a bit more noise at startup. Amsoil has been in the synthetic business a lot longer than Mobil 1, has a wider range of products and is more specialized. I run it on a 245K mi audi and it loves it. No oil leakage like rumor's like to jump on. On a car this old if it would leak because I put synthetic in it I sure don't see it. Amsoil rates their oils depending on the brand from 7500mi oil change to 35,000mi oil change because they use higher quality additives and detergents than other synthetics though it tapers off on their 7,500mi oil. I've ran Amsoil in my Honda V65 Mag. and it ran a lot cooler and smoother and def. cleaner on the inside of the crankcase than typical oils.
People that don't like synthetic's do not do research and tend to listen to rumors. With a high quality synthetic you save money even though it's a lot more expensive up front. You don't have to change it as often, the lack of engine wear makes engine overhauls and engine repairs cheaper and less frequent and better gas mileage. They all add up to overall less cost. It is thiner at cold weather, not thiner than typical oil, just thiner at cold startup temps which makes it get to needed engine parts faster and 90% of engine wear is during startup. Amsoil also offers top quality oil filters that are the same quality as mobil 1's so either of their's oil filters are fine. They cost a bit more but they trap finer particals. They have a fantastic oil soaked 2 stage air filter that breaths better and also traps finer particals, one stage traps larger and the second stops the finer so it doesn't clog as fast as regular and K&H filters.
You use regular pet. based oil you will see sludge buildup and you must change it ever 3000 mi as it breaks down, gets thicker with age or use and so as time goes on you get more and more startup wear to your engine. My audi my cousin gave me he ran Castol GTX and said he changed it every 3k mi. I trust him he had no reason to lie about it. The Crankcase breather tube was compleatly cloged with sludge, the lifters rattled and clacked for up to 10sec. at a cold startup.
After changing over to synthetic the lifters are quiet after 1 to 2 seconds max. The engine is smooth and I see 4mph better gas mileage but I have it in the tranny and rear end so I can say just putting it in the engine will increase the gas miles that much. I change the oil filter every 6mo and the oil every year. No sludge from this, in fact it's very very VERY clean from what I can see from the parts that had a lot of sludge before and I swear by it. I would never run any after market oil additives like slick 50 and those ilks as they are nothing but damage waiting to happen. Run good oil and your car will last a long time. Go cheap and you get what you pay for. Higher costs down the road but it's really more for people who want to keep their cars past 150k mi. anyway or really care about their car.
Also, Amsoil is the only company to actually compare their oil to name brand oils in tests instead of the typical Our's is better than the leading brand oils crap so if they arn't they would be open to many fat lawsuits that haven't come in many years of this. They stand behind their oils and are not afraid to take on bigger oil companies. But my second choice would be Mobil 1, it's a good oil but just not the best. I'm not totally sure about redline, I know they are a good synthetic oil but I don't have enough data on them to say one way or another.
If you have car's and motorcycles you def. want oils ment for them, you really don't want to run typical car oils in motorcycles, another reason for Amsoil, like I said, they make a wide range of oils, and motorcycle oils are different. Here I can only be vauge because I can't remember what I read about what the difference was exactly. They had a higher quanity of zinc or something that helped the high shear forces that happen in motorcycles that you don't get as bad in cars. It was something like that but I don't have that data here anymore. Typcal motorcycle oils usually have these same additives also. They also make their HD oil filters for motorcycles. Every person I put this oil into their cars is a firm beliver, that is the wrapup to this long post. I don't sell the oil but I def. like it enough to take the time to write these long posts. I'd talk about their new line of european oils but I got a lot of crap earlier from people who don't know it takes tests and certifications to qualify to the ratings that are imposed on any oils for euro markets so they stuck their foots in their mouth and I don't care for that kind of feedback for trying to help out Audi owners who may want Euro cert. oils It's in either a 5W-40 or a 0W-40 Weight range. I don't have those number here by they have them at their website. I've not seen a difference in a car's engine in any oil I've ever ran, that is why I push their oils. They also have synthetic Auto trans oil and synthetic 2 stroke oils and synthetics built to work better in diesel engines. Every oil for all engine apps they make a synthetic for it. That is their specialty. It's up to you whether you run it or not. Keep digging, try to read reports that are out there on the web about different oils as that would be better than this kind of stuff anyway as it's mostly preferences anyway. The main point is synthetic's have a huge range of pour point compared to reg. oils and so keep their same thickness on a lot wider range of temps. for better cold and extream hot temp operation. Good luck..

EuroTrasher

thanks for all the input everyone. Nice to get so many responses so quickly

B_WALLACH

I have one more for you here, it has tests with both Amsoil and Mobil 1 and praises each, it def. was not done by either as a selling point. Here is the link...
http://www.mr2.com/TEXT/synth_oil.txt

I also checked out some links to snake oil and I'd NEVER let that crap near any engine I owned. It tends to remove the surface layer of oil on the bearings so if you want worn out engine parts if you use it for any lenght of time it's your funeral.
After market additives has always been a shell game looking for easy money with no real certified tests to back up their claims and just use local good old boys to praise their products.

B_WALLACH

Where is this data come from? forward links and who is testing it? It's so far above any synthetics for such a low price I have doubts so proof would be nice. If it's from Castrol's website it's not at the main one as they don't post anything. I never trust claims that are so far above the norm and offered at half the cost. It would be nice if true. If it's in that chart form only it's a write off.

Audi Junkie

Just kidding. You need to go to the oil forum, where you can test your potion notions on people who are professionals. Amsoil is not the only answer, neither is 'ol 10w-40 or 20w-50. Imo, these cars belong on dino 15w-40 HDEO or 5w-40 HDEO. Sludge is not a problem with these oils at all. With the 10w-40/20w-50 elemental viscosity improvers shear directly into sludge and 30 weight oil in 3000 miles. The CGT just came off of Belgian Syntec 5w-40, a great oil but not any more desirable than the 15w-40 Delvac 1300S it is on now. The Delvac carries MB 228.3 specs which has a sludge stipulation, matter of a fact, the spec is identical to the latest 229.3 specs like M1 0w-40 except MPG and cold-cranking. I honestly think more experience with other oils will tempt you away from Amsoil eventually.<ul><li><a href="http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1">http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1</a</li></ul>

Audi Junkie

Formula SLX

__________________________________________________ ______________________________

Applications

Castrol Formula SLX is a "world beating" fully synthetic oil, ideal for all modern, technically advanced, petrol and diesel car engines. Castrol Formula SLX provides a more advanced level of protection and performance than conventional oils. Extensive research and development, backed by independent tests, have shown the clear superiority of Castrol Formula SLX against conventional engine oils and other fully synthetic lubricants.


__________________________________________________ ______________________________

Features / Benefits

- Unique fuel saving characteristics - free flowing qualities and exceptionally low frictional characteristics, combine to deliver substantial fuel economy savings. In field tests, Castrol Formula SLX averaged fuel savings of 5.54% against the oils used before.

- Virtually no engine wear - Castrol Formula SLX flows freely at -30ºC improving cold starting. Considering that 50% of all car journeys are under 7.5 miles and as it normally takes the engine 10 minutes to warm up, the unique free flowing characteristics of Castrol Formula SLX ensures that your engine is protected instantly using Castrol Formula SLX. At temperatures exceeding 300ºC Castrol Formula SLX prevents sludge build up and its low volatility minimises oil consumption

- Peak performance throughout even the longest service intervals - the specially selected base oils and additives ensure that the engine is protected from wear and deposit build up throughout even the longest service intervals

- Improved performance - the 0W-30 viscosity improves performance by lowering frictional resistance, giving power output improvements and a reduction in operating temperature

- Environmental protection - the 5.54% fuel savings result in less fuel being burnt and a low phosphorus content ensures the catalytic converter works at peak performance, thereby minimising the effects of harmful emissions.




http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=11;t=000102#000000< ul><li><a href="http://www.castrol.co.uk/eng/product_data_sheets.shtml">http://www.castrol.co.uk/eng/product_data_sheets.shtml</a</li></ul>

Kidquattro

Re:ditto. I run M1 15-50 in the two turbos and the 20v.

B_WALLACH

That is only half the story on sludge here is the rest and by the way synthetics prevent more than 9/10 of these better by far than reg. pet. oil which causes a lot of these factors:

SOOT: Soot is fine powder that is a product of incomplete combustion. This carbon substance enters the crankcase with exhaust blow-by gases that escape past the piston rings. Since soot is a very fine powder, it thickens oil by a process called "soot loading." It gels the oil like a cake mix thickens milk. If your motor oil becomes excessively thick, there will be less oil circulated through the engine. Also, the oil will leave a thicker oil film on the engine parts, which prevents proper heat transfer. By remaining on the hot parts, the oil will burn and form deposits.

HEAT: Engine heat, a natural result of internal combustion, takes its toll on your motor oil. In the presence of air, oil undergoes a process called oxidation, which becomes more severe as the temperature increases. Oxidation thickens the oil and produces corrosive acids. Left unchecked, your oil would degrade into a tar-like mess.

While you want your engine temperature above 210ºF to evaporate unwanted contaminants, above 250ºF the oil is more prone to oxidation. At temperatures of 300ºF, this process occurs rapidly. Oil companies have some additives that contain powerful oxidation inhibitors. These additives break down the oxidation cycle.

As long as these inhibitors are present, no significant oxidation will occur. However, these additives are consumed with time. After their depletion, oil oxidation proceeds rapidly. Regular oil changes are needed to remove the unwanted products of combustion and to replenish the supply of oxidation inhibitors.

FUEL: Fuel enters your crankcase with exhaust blow-by gases in unburned and partially burned forms. It is chemically unstable; therefore, it reacts with itself and the oil to form gums, varnishes and asphaltic-type compounds. These resinous substances are also unstable and react further to cause even more oil thickening.

WATER: Water gets into your crankcase typically through condensation or in exhaust gases that escape past the piston rings. It's your engine's job to get rid of this moisture by operating at sufficiently high temperatures. However, all engines operate periodically at low temps and experience some water contamination. When this occurs, water becomes emulsified. That is, it is absorbed by the oil, which thickens the lubricant. As a result, the oil does not flow or cool well. The increased viscosity can cause the oil to burn, creating engine deposits. Unfortunately, there is not much that engine oil can do to reduce the harmful effects of water. Oil changes every 3000 miles are the best way to take care of this problem.
Note here, this only applies to Pet. oils because they have different size molecular structor to them, the thiner oils burn off fast and the oil gets thicker with use, this DOES NOT HAPPEN TO SYNTHETICS as all their molecules are the same size!!!

ACIDS: When fuel burns, some products of combustion react with moisture in the system to form acids. These include sulfuric, hydrochloric and organic acids. Sulfur-based acids are undesirable because they attack the oil, reducing its detergency. Organic acids react with unburned fuel to promote sludge and varnish. In addition, acids can cause additive settling, or dropout.

DIRT: People associate dirt with engine wear. It can also play a role in sludge formation. Wear of piston rings and cylinder walls causes an increase in piston blow-by.

Since exhaust gases contain harmful by-products, their presence in the crankcase should be minimized. Some of these compounds will escape past the rings.

Note, synthetics have proved to seal engine rings and prevent blowby better which also helps prevet sludge.

ENGINE COOLANT (Antifreeze): Coolant is your engine oil's number one enemy. Engine sludge is inevitable when oil meets engine coolant. Contamination of your oil with coolant promotes sludge by two means. First, it introduces water into the oil. This presents problems that we've previously discussed. Second, it brings into contact oil and coolant, which are incompatible fluids.

Oil and coolant react to form deposits as they experience temperature changes in your engine. Some are gooey or gel-like. Others are hard, brittle deposits that plug oil passageways, reducing oil flow. These two types of deposits guarantee a shortened life for your engine.

No oil additives available will help solve this problem. The only solution is to drain the oil and locate the source of contamination. Then, have the mechanical problem repaired. These are the enemies of your engine oil -- Soot, Heat, Fuel, Water, Acid, Dirt &amp; Engine Coolant.

Sludge formation is the result of one or more of these factors:

· severe service driving with improper drain intervals

· mechanical malfunctions

· inadequate engine maintenance

Severe Service Driving: The term "severe service" refers to:

1. Short Trip/Stop &amp; Go

· going to the corner store

· driving in crowded downtown

2. Extended Idling

· sitting in traffic

· delivery truck operation

3. High temperature operation

· low speed driving at high

· ambient temperatures

4. Extreme Cold

· starting engine below 0^~F

5. Heavy Loads

· operating in hilly regions

· trailer Towing

6. Dusty Conditions

· more common than expected

Although some of these situations may not seem severe, they all put additional demands on your motor oil. Under these conditions, automakers require that drain intervals be reduced to three (3) months or 3000 miles. Compare this to "normal" drain intervals of 6000 to 12000 miles. Severe conditions are not uncommon. It is estimated that we operate our vehicles 80% of the time under severe service. Therefore, it is wise to establish 3000 mile or three (3) month drain intervals to assure proper maintenance unless you are sure that you're driving under the normal category.

Mechanical Malfunctions: A flat tire, engine knock or an electrical problem is easily identified. However, a small, subtle malfunction, like a leak from your cooling system into your crankcase, can create big problems for your engine. The resulting oil and coolant mixture reacts to form harmful deposits. An improperly operating cooling system will cause problems, too. If your thermostat sticks and does not allow coolant flow when needed, your engine will run hot. You might not even notice the difference on your temp gauge. Constant elevated temperatures promote oil thickening, after thousands of miles, this can create sludge.

A clogged or defective PCV valve can contribute to sludge formation. If this valve does not operate properly, harmful exhaust gases remain in the crankcase. These gases, which contain water, acids, soot, etc., promote sludge.

Poor Engine Maintenance: Lack of engine maintenance is probably responsible for more sludged engines than all other categories. Establish proper drain intervals for your type of driving. A timely oil change interval of 3,000 miles or every 3 months is inexpensive insurance for your car's engine.

Use the proper quality oil for your engine. Never use oil that is rated less than the minimum API Service Category specified by your car manufacturer. To assure yourself proper quality, use oil that is rated API SJ or contains the ILSAC "starburst" symbol on the product label. This symbol assures that the oil has been tested and certified to meeting minimum requirements.

Finally, the cooling system must be flushed and refilled periodically with a proper water/coolant mixture to prevent engine overheating and offer optimum engine performance.

Some other conditions that promote sludge are: clogged air filter, low oil level, low coolant level, bad fuel, etc.

Often, the oil seems to be at fault. But more often, oil is the victim of mechanical malfunctions, extended oil drains or a poorly tuned engine. What can you do to make sure that sludge won't drive your engine to an early grave?

· Change your oil and filter every 3000 miles or three (3) months, whichever is sooner.

· Maintain your vehicle in good operating condition.

· Make sure your car is well tuned. Efficient, lean combustion produces fewer harmful acids, soot, unburned fuel than a rough running engine.

· Be aware of unusual indicators like high oil pressure, gummy oil on the dipstick, a flooded valve deck or excessive exhaust smoke.

· Use an API SJ, high quality motor oil.

SO if oil didn't last this long why is it that in europe using synthetics they recomend 20k mi. drain intervals? They do but mercedies screwed up in their manual and a lot were damaged by pet. based oils being used for 20k mi. They are being sued about this fact.
This link of posts was about why to use synthetics, I like Amsoil and have used Mobil 1, Castrol Syntec. before they blended it and found Amsoil better in the feel of the motor and oil use and overall smoothmess and the time it took the quite the damm audi lifters. I don't are if people like other ones better, that's fine as long as they know their limits and don't go above them. Synthetics are proven better in every catagory or the Army wouldn't use it in their cars and truck in artic conditions, truck fleets wouldn't use it in their long haul high mileage trucks and the Airforce wouldn't use it in their jet engines. It's a fact. I told you it was a personal opinon and to do your own research but you could not help but though in a line of crap and to you, I could care less if you don't care. Your missing the point of this line of posts!!! If you want to bash something go find a tree and use your fat head. And I thought because these were better cars smarter people buy them, so much for that one.

B_WALLACH

Re: Tell someone who cares... PS, I was joking too on the last one...