B&O Upgrade: Mids & Tweeters
06-23-2024, 03:02 AM
#31
AudiWorld Member
https://www.parts-express.com/5-kHz-...472?quantity=1
here ya go! I bought a couple to use in my a-pillars but ended up liking the 6.8uf 1st order.
and just using a 1st order low pass @ like 5k and an 8uf cap on the back tweeter. Prob not ideal, but what Bobby was using at the time and sounds good.
Honestly, I’m about to start a “what is your current audio setup” thread, so we can keep track of what we’re all actually running
here ya go! I bought a couple to use in my a-pillars but ended up liking the 6.8uf 1st order.
and just using a 1st order low pass @ like 5k and an 8uf cap on the back tweeter. Prob not ideal, but what Bobby was using at the time and sounds good.
Honestly, I’m about to start a “what is your current audio setup” thread, so we can keep track of what we’re all actually running
Last edited by Volvo_Expert; 06-23-2024 at 03:16 AM.
06-23-2024, 03:06 AM
#32
AudiWorld Member
Something doesn't sound right if you have to crank the bass up to +5. The Silver Flutes you have are the 8ohm versions, not the 4 ohm versions? The amp will not tolerate 4 ohms there, and will likely cut power to those channels.
The Aurum Cantus AC165 are strong in the bass with excellent definition, but are hard to get in Europe and possibly more than you want to spend. An alternative to the Aurum Cantus in terms of bass punch could be Ciare.
Despite Bobby's comment in his spreadsheet, the one person who used a Ciari HWG160 8 ohm 165mm/6.5" and posted details on the install liked it. Easy to get in Europe. As it happens, he was from Germany, and he seemed fanatical on getting things right:
https://www.audiworld.com/forums/aud.../#post25582981
He also liked the Dayton tweeters, and used FaitalPRO 4F32 mids, but used an inductor with them - a good move. Ciare also have another less expensive model, the HWB160, which also should deliver good bass in the door:
But Crazydrummer likes his Dayton DSA175-8, so they seem a great option at their price point.
There are various 2nd order crossovers available. The problem is that that for two way 2nd order crossovers (mid low pass, tweeter high pass) the location where Audi splits the cabling is unknown, and possible painful to trace. If just using a single way 2nd order crossover, there isn't enough room on the A pillars for the typically oversized boxes.
The 2nd order crossover for the tweeter isn't too bad though, just adding one inductor (coil) that connects in parallel (so connects between positive and negative wires). For the Dayton (which has 3.7 ohms impedance at 4700kHz) a 2nd order is:
The Aurum Cantus AC165 are strong in the bass with excellent definition, but are hard to get in Europe and possibly more than you want to spend. An alternative to the Aurum Cantus in terms of bass punch could be Ciare.
Despite Bobby's comment in his spreadsheet, the one person who used a Ciari HWG160 8 ohm 165mm/6.5" and posted details on the install liked it. Easy to get in Europe. As it happens, he was from Germany, and he seemed fanatical on getting things right:
https://www.audiworld.com/forums/aud.../#post25582981
He also liked the Dayton tweeters, and used FaitalPRO 4F32 mids, but used an inductor with them - a good move. Ciare also have another less expensive model, the HWB160, which also should deliver good bass in the door:
- https://www.ciare.com/en/products/lf...r/6.5/8/HWG160
- https://www.ciare.com/en/products/lf...r/6.5/8/HWB160
- https://en.toutlehautparleur.com/bra...mpedance=11078
But Crazydrummer likes his Dayton DSA175-8, so they seem a great option at their price point.
There are various 2nd order crossovers available. The problem is that that for two way 2nd order crossovers (mid low pass, tweeter high pass) the location where Audi splits the cabling is unknown, and possible painful to trace. If just using a single way 2nd order crossover, there isn't enough room on the A pillars for the typically oversized boxes.
The 2nd order crossover for the tweeter isn't too bad though, just adding one inductor (coil) that connects in parallel (so connects between positive and negative wires). For the Dayton (which has 3.7 ohms impedance at 4700kHz) a 2nd order is:
06-24-2024, 12:51 PM
#34
I really like these https://en.toutlehautparleur.com/bra...-6-5-inch.html and thank you for pointing me in that direction. The frequency is nice and flat with the sensitivity 2db higher than the silver flutes. I will order these and try them.
06-24-2024, 04:53 PM
#35
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
Hahaha the foam DID cost more than the speaker now that you say that!! At least I have a ton left over. Tbf I bought it as part of his “door” kit and the discounts essentially got me them “free”.
On another note, moving from a car a slapped with 20sq feet of dynamat into one that has nothing is a BIG difference. Like bigger than I would’ve guessed. I’m trying to do this one a little more professionally on the sound deadening front (hence the rosonix stuff). Going to CLD/dynamat everything, followed by 1/2” fiber sound absorber every where I can minus probably taking the headliner out. Will report back if I think it’s worth it over just regular dynamat. Although I will say the s5 seems a better/more solid/dead/tight together to start with as a base than my a5 did.
Anyone have any recs on a NICE trim removal set, I’m tired of going through them once a year
Also still looking for some oem tweeters/housings if anyone wants to sell their’s. I’ve gotta redo my hack job that’s current in my car with new nd25’s at some point. Figure I ask here before going to eBay
On another note, moving from a car a slapped with 20sq feet of dynamat into one that has nothing is a BIG difference. Like bigger than I would’ve guessed. I’m trying to do this one a little more professionally on the sound deadening front (hence the rosonix stuff). Going to CLD/dynamat everything, followed by 1/2” fiber sound absorber every where I can minus probably taking the headliner out. Will report back if I think it’s worth it over just regular dynamat. Although I will say the s5 seems a better/more solid/dead/tight together to start with as a base than my a5 did.
Anyone have any recs on a NICE trim removal set, I’m tired of going through them once a year
Also still looking for some oem tweeters/housings if anyone wants to sell their’s. I’ve gotta redo my hack job that’s current in my car with new nd25’s at some point. Figure I ask here before going to eBay
I suspect 99% of trim removal tools are all produced at the same Chinese factory, and then sold under hundreds of different brand names. With profit margins ranging from 5% to 500%.
One exception that has been cited as premium for the last decade or so is Bojo, made in the US:
Bojo Prying Tools
Never used them myself.
Audi do sell very specific pry tools through their parts operation, which I suspect will be high quality. But they are expensive, around $20 each IIRC. So forget it.
06-24-2024, 04:55 PM
#36
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
06-24-2024, 05:02 PM
#37
Club AutoUnion
I highly recommend Sound Skins foam tape for any and all speaker surrounds, mounting tabs and etc. Even a little bit in key locations be make a meaningful change.
06-24-2024, 05:54 PM
#38
The other side of the coin with large swathes of bituminous sound treatments like Dynamat, then add Basser boxes, heavy subwoofers etc is that you are adding quite a bit of weight to the car. I swear I can feel it, am tempted to take out the space saver spare to rebalance things a bit.
I suspect 99% of trim removal tools are all produced at the same Chinese factory, and then sold under hundreds of different brand names. With profit margins ranging from 5% to 500%.
One exception that has been cited as premium for the last decade or so is Bojo, made in the US:
Bojo Prying Tools
Never used them myself.
Audi do sell very specific pry tools through their parts operation, which I suspect will be high quality. But they are expensive, around $20 each IIRC. So forget it.
I suspect 99% of trim removal tools are all produced at the same Chinese factory, and then sold under hundreds of different brand names. With profit margins ranging from 5% to 500%.
One exception that has been cited as premium for the last decade or so is Bojo, made in the US:
Bojo Prying Tools
Never used them myself.
Audi do sell very specific pry tools through their parts operation, which I suspect will be high quality. But they are expensive, around $20 each IIRC. So forget it.
06-25-2024, 03:11 AM
#39
AudiWorld Member
Definitely more pronounced and clearer with the face sealed against the door panel. Luckily I had a spare peerless on hand because one started to short out the second I pushed on the door panel. It was not the wiring but the actual speaker.
06-26-2024, 08:10 AM
#40
AudiWorld Super User
Thread Starter
Certainly a good idea to seal and dampen everything possible. I use a range of products from Monacor (Germany), Tesa (Germany), and TLHP (France) for different thicknesses, width and damping vs sealing etc.
I do think the door skins benefit from damping with foam tape:
There is a unique issue with the Peerless GBR-115N/etc dome midrange as the dome hits the door skin's grill unless it is moved back 5mm. I just used a 5mm thick M6 nut on each bolt hole to get the space, then close the resulting gap using foam tape. Not ideal, a full 5mm spacer would be better, but would be difficult to find. It needs to have an internal opening diameter of 92mm, and an external diameter of 106mm. Stacking suitably sized gaskets or 3D printing the best options, I think.
That will be a consideration for some cone mids as well, as the roll surround often protrudes past the frame/mounting ring. Whilst 3.5to 4.5" mids don't have much extension (unless being wild driven to clipping at Xmax), they still need 4mm allowance. Which is why jl226CA's mounting of the ScanSpeak 10M seen in post #2 includes a thick piece of foam to provide space. It looks like has has then used a sealant bead, similar to Monacor MDM-25 to dampen (no seal is needed here) the AliExpress adapter against the back of the 10M's mounting ring.
Conversely, the FaitalPRO 4FE32 has the roll surround recessed below the mounting ring, which is lipped. In fact, it has a foam seal around the inner edge of the lip which protrudes about 2mm or so. So it self-seals, and fits like a glove on the OEM location (after grinding off an ear or two). I doubt there is any other mid out there that needs less work to get it in than the 4FE32.
Still, looking at your shopping list of speakers on the other thread, anecdotal interest for you only. I would have thought Audison AP2 would sound a little thin in terms of tonality and volume as a midrange replacement in the doors, although the AP4 I looked at seems to be too wide across the magnet. Within the B&O system parameters, these door mids have a tough life.
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