Open Post to AW managment.
04-15-2009, 07:25 AM
#11
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once again, [in the voice of Seinfeld] who are these people ?????
the 4-6 guys who ceremoniously left AW, who used to post non-stop, mostly in OT, about what lunch they are about to have, or how short the skirt is today, on some secretary at work.
is it those few guys without whom AW is now dead ??
the 4-6 guys who ceremoniously left AW, who used to post non-stop, mostly in OT, about what lunch they are about to have, or how short the skirt is today, on some secretary at work.
is it those few guys without whom AW is now dead ??
04-15-2009, 11:49 AM
#12
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It's funny....some would same I'm crazy and maybe even exagerating the situation a little bit. Well I made my comments less then 24 hours ago and already have gotten 3 PM's from site advertisers expressing thanks for seeing their point of view.
I would post all the "thank you" messages I received but some of them kindly asked that I don't. Here are the comments of one vendor who gave me permission to post his comments anonymously:
There are some pretty interesting truths to be told. For example, what happened to the "donated" money that was used to start QW? From the first couple days of it's start, I lurked....and within two days I saw advertisements, for which I presume the vendors paid. I also happen to run a VERY high bandwith website, and guess how much it costs me? $49 montly! That's it. So where is the donation money?
Point number 2: Soliciting AW advertisers? Come on. You never saw Audizine or Fourtitude playing cut-throat games to basically ruin a community that has existed for years. QW operates without dignity and under the guise of "providing a familiar place of refuge", meanwhile their goal is clear.
Again...I won't do it. I'll stay here and support the people who have supported me. I'm a person of principle, and in my opinion, those who left here and never looked back....are not.
I would post all the "thank you" messages I received but some of them kindly asked that I don't. Here are the comments of one vendor who gave me permission to post his comments anonymously:
Originally Posted by anonymous
All I can say is thank you for putting how some of "us" vendors feel about this ridiculous AW versus QW battle. It is hard for some of us to voice our opinion publicly in fear that any vendor alienates any potential customer, especially considering the current economic climate. I've spoken with Kris openly about how I, and some other vendors, feel that QW has done nothing beneficial for the community and in fact it does a disservice to it under the guise it is a utopia against the big evil corporately owned forum. In fact QW is a business and as seen in posts the owners/creators specifically want people to leave AW, stop visiting AW and produce as many page views as possible to create a base to sell advertising based on numbers they can sell to advertisers. I wish more people would see this and get over the childish initial reaction, come back to the place that started it all and has always been here. If QW wants to offer a KAWF based alternative then go ahead, but the battle to destroy AW and take it's participants for it's own financial benefit is bad for the community. We have yet another rift to overcome and as an advertiser just another expensive place to advertise just so we can reach another subsection of the community. I mean they started the business with donations, friggen donations and the site was littered with advertisements in hours of it's inception, not to mention all of the advertisers here have been contacted by the former head of advertising from AW to pay for advertising on QW...
Thank you for seeing the situation for what it really is, a disservice to the community at large and a shrewd business move by the creators of QW.
Thank you for seeing the situation for what it really is, a disservice to the community at large and a shrewd business move by the creators of QW.
There are some pretty interesting truths to be told. For example, what happened to the "donated" money that was used to start QW? From the first couple days of it's start, I lurked....and within two days I saw advertisements, for which I presume the vendors paid. I also happen to run a VERY high bandwith website, and guess how much it costs me? $49 montly! That's it. So where is the donation money?
Point number 2: Soliciting AW advertisers? Come on. You never saw Audizine or Fourtitude playing cut-throat games to basically ruin a community that has existed for years. QW operates without dignity and under the guise of "providing a familiar place of refuge", meanwhile their goal is clear.
Again...I won't do it. I'll stay here and support the people who have supported me. I'm a person of principle, and in my opinion, those who left here and never looked back....are not.
04-15-2009, 03:16 PM
#14
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^ i understand, thats why i said right away to 'assume only half remain'... ok even assume 1/10th remain - thats still thousands upon thousands... where are they ? they were all here during the kawf days... posting away non-stop all day and all night.... in OT, and in Regional... why did they suddenly disappear when we switched to vB ???
SO, i still think its not 'QW' to blame, they are a business, and have a right to do whatever is beneficial to them (capitalism)... rather its the AW members who left and abandoned AW w/o giving vB a chance, who are to blame!
look, no one who left was a baby! all adults who made a conscious decision. so how is QW to blame ?? its like the **** guards whose excuse has always been "were following orders"... no u werent! they knew exactly what they were doing, and loved every minute of it!
btw, sorry for such graphic example...
SO, i still think its not 'QW' to blame, they are a business, and have a right to do whatever is beneficial to them (capitalism)... rather its the AW members who left and abandoned AW w/o giving vB a chance, who are to blame!
look, no one who left was a baby! all adults who made a conscious decision. so how is QW to blame ?? its like the **** guards whose excuse has always been "were following orders"... no u werent! they knew exactly what they were doing, and loved every minute of it!
btw, sorry for such graphic example...
Last edited by S6devil; 04-15-2009 at 03:19 PM.
04-15-2009, 08:20 PM
#15
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Keep this in mind. Those who have been on AW long enough know that the entire kawf forum software was written by JT and the founders of this site.
Anyone ever stop to wonder how QW got their hands on it? Hmmmm....
Anyone ever stop to wonder how QW got their hands on it? Hmmmm....
04-15-2009, 08:34 PM
#16
Cat Herder
04-16-2009, 12:41 PM
#17
AudiWorld Senior Member
some very interesting points in this thread, and eventhough I post on QW I will continue to post on AW, because the format change is no big deal to me. In fact AW is still my homepage.
Last edited by littleredwagen; 04-16-2009 at 12:53 PM.
04-16-2009, 05:32 PM
#18
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I just think it is a matter of perference. I am part of a lot of Vbulletin forums but like Audiworld for tha change of pace if brought using kawf. I will still read and contribute to Audiworld but most of my friends are on QW so I will mostly be there because of that fact.
I do agree with Paul's point though, it comes down to business. I don't think that anyone is doing any favors here or there. In the end everyone is just in it for money both here and QW.
I do agree with Paul's point though, it comes down to business. I don't think that anyone is doing any favors here or there. In the end everyone is just in it for money both here and QW.
04-17-2009, 02:40 AM
#19
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My personal belief is that forums should be a place for the exchange of information and "open" discussions. I enjoy AW and have been able to get and hopefully give great information in discussions with other members. I do understand that it is a business, and have supported many of the advertisers buy buying their products. I will always give preference to an advertiser for supporting the forum, especially the advertisers here who post information, help customers use their products or give helpful tips.
However; if posts get deleted or censored than i believe this impedes the flow of "true" information. Even in the old format; i noticed posts were deleted that showed a product with a cheaper price or a better review than an advertiser's product. Yes, this happened to a few of my posts.
In my opinion, every one wins with free flow of information:
Members get the best bang for their buck and thus will return to the site.
Members get information on products and services they may not know about or are able to make an intelligent decision on purchasing a product.
Advertisers can see what customers are willing to spend for a particular product and make the adjustments to become more competitive.
Advertiser's product will be defended and cheered if their product or service is better.
AW might get new advertisers, if a potential advertiser detects customer traffic has been generated from this site.
More posts will be made, thus making the site have more hits and giving advertisers more visibility.
Once censorship begins, how can you trust any information you read?
However; if posts get deleted or censored than i believe this impedes the flow of "true" information. Even in the old format; i noticed posts were deleted that showed a product with a cheaper price or a better review than an advertiser's product. Yes, this happened to a few of my posts.
In my opinion, every one wins with free flow of information:
Members get the best bang for their buck and thus will return to the site.
Members get information on products and services they may not know about or are able to make an intelligent decision on purchasing a product.
Advertisers can see what customers are willing to spend for a particular product and make the adjustments to become more competitive.
Advertiser's product will be defended and cheered if their product or service is better.
AW might get new advertisers, if a potential advertiser detects customer traffic has been generated from this site.
More posts will be made, thus making the site have more hits and giving advertisers more visibility.
Once censorship begins, how can you trust any information you read?
04-17-2009, 06:52 AM
#20
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^^^ I agree with everything you've said. But my point is this: OK, sure, QW is a business just like Audiworld. But why do they continue to solicit donations to keep the site running when they have advertisors?? Go ahead send an email to the QW admins asking for their advertising rates...you'll be shocked. It takes probably no more then $100 to pay for the monthly webhosting, and once set up, the forums runs themselves.
So they turn to their members to help support their site, all while ACTIVELY trying to deter members from using Audiworld?? And they do all this under the guise of helping the "community". I'm sorry, the only person it's helping is them, and quite frankly, in a unethical way if you ask me. You don't see Anthony from Audizine posting on his forums telling people to stop using Audiworld.
At the end of the day, we will all suffer because advertisors who now have to pay a few thousand more $$ to advertise on yet another site will a) not be able to offer the same forum member deals they used to, and b) will not be able to actively participate the same way they did because they've now got another forum to monitor, all while trying to run their business.
The whole thing is so obvious that it just baffles me that so many people don't see what's going on.
So they turn to their members to help support their site, all while ACTIVELY trying to deter members from using Audiworld?? And they do all this under the guise of helping the "community". I'm sorry, the only person it's helping is them, and quite frankly, in a unethical way if you ask me. You don't see Anthony from Audizine posting on his forums telling people to stop using Audiworld.
At the end of the day, we will all suffer because advertisors who now have to pay a few thousand more $$ to advertise on yet another site will a) not be able to offer the same forum member deals they used to, and b) will not be able to actively participate the same way they did because they've now got another forum to monitor, all while trying to run their business.
The whole thing is so obvious that it just baffles me that so many people don't see what's going on.