DennisM

edit: After looking at some other Syntec 5W-40 uoa's, I'm now suspicious that this may not even be what the dealer claimed it is. The high calcium, low magnesium, and way low viscosity is typical of the latest GF5 Resource Conserving oils.

I guess I'll be swapping this out before the 10k mile service!

This is my wife's car and she has AudiCare. It's driven about 25 miles each way to work and occasionally on weekends. The drive to work is hilly and twisty so the engine gets a good workout. I did a uoa to help me decide if I felt comfortable going to 10k miles as Audi recommends. This is Syntec 5W-40 dealer fill. After I took the sample through the dipstick tube, I added 1/2 quart of German Castrol (Syntec 0W-30) since it was a little low. The si and al is probably still from wear-in and the shearing to a mid 30 grade probably isn't all that unusual for Syntec 5W-40. Maybe the next run would be better after a little more break-in is complete. My dealer has another oil option so I'll be checking that out as well.

UOA by Oil Analyzers Inc.

Comments: Lubricant and filter change is suggested if not done at sampling time; Infared results indicate that NITRATION is at a SIGNIFICANT LEVEL; Aluminum is at a MODERATE LEVEL; Abrasives (silicon/dirt) are at a MINOR LEVEL; Flagged data has been rechecked and reconfirmed.

Equipment make: Audi
Equipment model: 3.2L V6
Oil use interval: 5,591 miles
Oil capacity: 7 Qts.
Oil type & Grade: Castrol Syntec 5W-40
Make-up oil added: 0
Miles on unit: 10,760
Air filter: OEM
Oil filter: OEM
Overall severity of report = 3 abnormal

Iron 30
Chromium 0
Nickel 0
Aluminum 11
Copper 12
Lead 0
Tin 2
Cadmium 0
Silver 0
Silicon 26
Sodium 61
Potassium 3
Titanium 0
Molybdenum 7
Antimony 3
Manganese 6
Lithium 0
Boron 14
Magnesium 18
Calcium 2096
Barium 1
Phosphorus 690
Zinc 811

Fuel % 1.9%
Soot <.1%
Water <.1%
Vis @ 100C: 10.7 (starts at 13.9 according to Castrol)
TBN 3.37
Oxidation 14
Nitration 28 (abnormal)

Lube chg: No
Filter chg: No

Information on nitration:
Nitration indicates excessive "blow-by" from cylinder walls and/or compression rings. It also indicates the presence of nitric acid, which speeds up oxidation. Too much disparity between oxidation and nitration can point to air to fuel ratio problems. As oxidation / nitration increases, so will total acid number and viscosity, while total base number will begin to decrease. Nitration is primarily a problem in natural gas engines.
http://www.polarislabs.com/test-expl.../nitration.php

-Dennis

CrustyNoodle

Nice info.

Do you mind me asking how much did the analysis cost and how long did it take to get the results?

JohnBoyToo

Hmmm, been doing oil analysis for years for our diesels due to shearing and viscosity drop in the dino oils, but never considered it for our gas engines.... good idea - I have some sampler bottles in the garage, but I don't have a dipstick on our 2.0 T

My question would be is this consider a by-product of the DI engine or is this an indication of something wrong with the engine ?!?

What did your analysis company say ? (Mine usually indicates a potential source or cause of the concern - http://www.blackstone-labs.com/)

I think you are wise to let the engine break in a bit more & test again to see if it improves since @ your mileage this is only the second batch of oil correct ? Changed @ 5k ?

DennisM

One of the first things that I did when we got this car was to buy a dipstick! The 2.0T doesn't have a plugged up dipstick tube like the 3.2's? https://www.audiworld.com/forums/sho....php?t=2785416

I used Blackstone for years, but switched to Oil Analyzers Inc because it was a better bang for the buck. http://oaitesting.com/
For $22.45, plus your shipping back to the lab, they check for more oil additives than Blackstone (like antimony), but they also include TBN, oxidation, and nitration. Blackstone charges $10 for TBN. I bought an oil pump to take the sample through the dipstick tube and I got my results about a week and a half after I mailed the sample.

Looking at other uoa's and a virgin oil analysis I'm pretty sure that the dealer did not use Syntec 5W-40.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums...67#Post2365767
Zinc and phosphorus are different, but the dispersent/detergent additives are way off. Syntec 5W-40 has always shown lower calcium and higher magnesium than my report. It could be a mislabeled oil drum instead of a dealer mistake.

Yes, the fuel dilution and viscosity shear to a 30 weight oil is typical for DI. I may just change the oil myself depending how much headache this turns out to be with the dealer (which is not where we bought the car from). I emailed Castrol and I'll see if they tell me anything.

-Dennis

JohnBoyToo

Thanks, good info Dennis !
will be doing the same myself soon as we are at about 18k miles...


Does it take a generic oil pump so the suction tube fits into the dipstick ?

DennisM

This is the pump that I bought:
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/G1206.aspx
This is the one from Blackstone:
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/vacuum-pump.php

-Dennis

gat821

As I'm also trying to determine if it's ok to do 10k mile oil changes, I've also had oil on our 2011 3.2 Q5 analyzed. To provide a comparison to DennisM's oil, here's mine at 7,400 miles - from Blackstone. The Q5 was on 22k total miles when this was done.

It's interesting that Blackstone is saying Silicon (at 18) could be to blame for extra metal, but in DennisM's oil analysis, Oil Analyzers are saying silicon (at 26) is minor. Though perhaps it's not necessarily contradictory, i.e. minor contamination = 'extra metal' that Blackstone states in the comments. They really didn't say a lot of extra metal vs minor amount of extra metal.

As seen in DennisM's oil, viscosity was also down to 30-grade. I'll be sampling again at the next 7500 mile mark and see how it goes. I may go with Oil Analyzers though - seems like a better deal, with a bit more data.

DennisM

The silicon is interesting. In my uoa, it could be from sand-casted parts from a new engine since there's only about 10k miles on it. Usually if it's dirt, more wear metals would read higher. Your iron is a little elevated though for such a short run. That's why it's good to do several uoa's to make sure everything starts to settle down.

But looking at your calcium and magnesium, that's typical of the 5W-40 Syntec uoa/voa's that I've seen and not typical of my uoa. I checked the receipt and the part number for oil matches up to the part numbers that I found on line for the Syntec. I haven't heard back from Castrol and I probably won't since I told them that I suspected lab error or the dealer used the wrong oil.

I'll probably change out the oil today and probably won't sample again until we hit 6,000 miles on the dealer oil change at 15k miles.

uberwgn

That would truly suck if the dealer isn't even using a 502.00 compliant oil This is one of the reasons I feel I must change my own oil.

I've questioned my dealer numerous times about what oil they use and they "think" it's M1 0W40.

DER KONIG PANZER

I added a dip stick to my 2012 2.0T, purchased from the dealer for $27.00. I changed the oil at 1K miles, now have 4100, I will change it at 5K then every 5K. I did a soft break in. No oil usage from MMI or dip stick!! I use Mobil 1 0w-40 and a Mahn filter (OEM VW/Audi),same for my BMWs and sons SAAB. The cost is like $32.00 at Advance when it is on sale (oil and Filter). I keep all my receipts. I don't want the Audi free 5K service. I even change the oil on my BMWs in between the "free" service.