rfmassa

Any recommendations based on experiance with the following winter tires would be helpful.

I live in Michigan, and will be getting new wheels and tires for my 2010 S-Line for the winter. The 20" HP summer tires won't make it!

Based on several recommendations I am looking at:
Nokian Hakka R series
Dunlop Winter SP Sport 3D
Pirelli Scorpion Snow and ice


Thanks.

kleinbus

You got the Nokian right on top but living past 20 years in middle of snow at Arctic Circle, I never knew Dunlop and Pirelli is promoted to "real winter tire" category

I would say
1) Nokian Hakka
2) either Bridgestone Blizzak or Michelin X-Ice

What ever you buy, just remember it is not the acceleration traction issue, it is the stopping traction issue, so your ability to slow down advance before you would need to slam the brakes is the one that defines you as a tallented driver.

rfmassa

Thanks Kleinbus.
I listed Dunlop specifically because of two people who have them on Audis and BMWs for winter use and swear by them as great for Michigan winters where we get snow a dozen times a year that might be really bad. This Winter Sport is a hybrid of performance and traction in winter.

I am concerned as to how well the Nokians will wear and perform in dry winter weather, and noise, etc. I have always heard for years they were some of the best. And how well they will do in the transistion period of spring and late fall.

rfmassa

I think I remember an earlier thread that you have Nokians on your Q5?
If so, are they the Hakka R 235/60 R18 107R series?
I am going for 18" wheels not 17".
I don't think I could take the shock going from S-Line 20" to 17"!

kleinbus

I wanted Nokian Hakka's but ended up Blizzak.

Mine is on 18" rims and 20 could work but it is much harder and noisier than 18 or 17.

Wear...
Real winter tire is really soft compound so dry pavement eats it like hot knife goes to butter. Biggest factor is how you drive, on dry pavement if you drive winters like summers, then heck yes those wear out in snap of finger. Corner hard and it ears the shoulders, take off pedal on floor and brake crazy and you get freaking noisy tires in no time.

Last winter I drove Kansas-Denver-Vegas-LA for christmas holidays and back. Back home I checked tires to see did LA sunny pavement kill my tires and all I noticed was each **** was worn "edgy" meaning front of each sipes was higher than back. That is normal wear and makes tire noisy so no matter it is directional tire, I turned them to run wrong direction for 2 last weeks of season and then changed to summer tires. During the change I rechecked the sipes and saw them worn back to flat so I had those ready for next winter. I sold the Tiguan with tires so I bought new Blizzaks with rims for Q5.

Hybrid? Performance and traction on winter tire?? LOL what a sales talk just to sell and get money in their pockets.

Scandinavia we don't close the roads no matter how bad it gets so to me there is no performance on winter tires, there is only traction, traction and traction.

With studded you could go a bit wilder but unstudded you can't corner because if you loose the traction you slide out or to oncoming. You slam the brakes and ABS starts keeping that grinding sound that means you just fu#¤ed up going way too fast for the current conditions meaning you lost the traction.

Performance means speed that means harder rubber compound that means less traction.

It is a circle that we go around, we can't have all, but we can have part of it, some desires speed and they get less traction, one wants traction for snow and ice but they have to pay attention to their driving style and speed.

Lucky me I grew up with snow and cars, had chance to drive different car brands with different tire brands, from big beemers and MB's to VW Transporter Syncro's and so on. Tried bing bong brands like Hankook and learnt cheap is expensive (meaning it is hard and slippery and may make you crash).

There is few tire brands that have spend their time studying winter driving conditions and tire bahaviour and there is lot of brands that try to copy the good ones but they are still far behind....

rfmassa

Thanks so much for the great response. I do drive responsibly in the winter. A lot less spirited than summer, for sure. I've lived here all my life and do know how to drive the slick roads - and never been in an accident in 40 years of driving.
We don't winters like you get, so I probbaly don't need the ultimate snow tire, and that's why I am struggling with this decision for the 90% of the time the roads are dry and unslick in the winter.

-Thanks again.

kleinbus

Good to hear you grew up with that white slippery stuff and you adjust your driving style for winter, folks here in Kansas do amaze me, every winter snow comes and roads gets icy and still they don't learn to slow down.

My Blizzaks are overkill for Kansas winter but we cross rockies few times every winter when we visit family and past trips with real winter tires in middle of snow blizzard at rockies showed me I didn't waste any money with those tires.

Second set of rims do make swap easy and I can do it in middle of night if needed. No calling the tire shop nor driving there and waiting to get things done.

Which ever brand you choose, enjoy the miles ahead...

GolfGL

I picked up Gislaved Nord*frost5 for the Q5 in 17". I haven't had a chance to try them out yet (obviously) but they had good reviews on the net.

kleinbus

My parents back in Finland used to use Gislaved's when they were own brand, some time ago it was bought out from competition by Continental.

Tread pattern looks copy from Nokian Hakka 5 but I don't know about tire itself as I have not used it.

2009 winter tire tests made by 2 different car magazines tested

Bridgestone Noranza2
Continental ContiWinterViking2
Gislaved NordFrost 5
Hankook Winter i*Pike W409
Kumho Izenwis KW19
Michelin X-Ice North
Nokian Hakkapeliitta 5
Wanli Winter-Challenger


No matter these are Nordic tires, meaning lower speed rating with softest rubber compound, test was clear for the "bing bong" brands like Hankook / Kumho / Wanli, do not buy these tires to be as winter tires are those are as slippery as summer tires. I have tried Hankook winter tires and I would not buy those again.

Some of these tires are regional and are not sold or imported to other countries.

Top 5, in random order, Conti / Bridges / Gislaved / Michelin / Nokian are always on top and test results affected by tester probaganda and by own fixations

If I would live really north were whole winter season I would be able to drive on clean pure snowy and icy roads with no salt nor similar nor sand, I would get studded Nokians right on the spot as studded allows higher speed than chain.

Normal smooth chains and even cables are the ultimate traction but haves really low speed limit and I have those tractor type spike chains for my 4x4 if I go winter off-roading...

GolfGL

Thanks for the insight kleinbus!