mm

And I honestly believe that one of these days, not too long from now, the Japanese are really going to start tapping into the sport/performance/luxury sedan market in a serious way, the same way Lexus did with the Mercedes luxury market, and really show the Germans a thing or two. That will be a great day, and it's coming soon. It's already starting to happen, slowly, but surely.

Todd Templeton

I couldn't agree more mm. I love my European cars, but the premiums we are now expected to pay has simply outpaced their superiority. Look at the pricing of the 350Z and the G35. Lots of R&D went into the making of those cars also. Your Accord example should make people think long and hard about what they are paying for. Think about it, they are all made of similar metals and plastics. OEM suppliers probably charge the same for components for an Infiniti as they do for an Audi or BMW. German workers are well paid, but so are Japanese workers. Volvos R cars prove that an exclusive high performance version of an existing car can be produced in Europe for a relatively small premium over it's mainstream stablemate. I read somewhere that Swedish taxes and wages were even higher than Germany's. I think the what's happening here is that BMW and Audi have become conceited, while Volvo and Infiniti are making an honest effort to EARN more customers.

outofca

I hope you're right. Competition keeps everyone honest and on their toes.

JDBlueAudiS4

I have always had a strong loyalty to the Lexus/Toyota Family. In fact my familys cars are normally Split Audi/VW & Toyota/Lexus almost 50/50. We got a subaru a year ago to see what it was like, going to replace it with the new TT when it comes out. I have driven many cars, and I have my favorites. Call it brand or type preconception or whatever you want, Its just what I like. I have a short list of cars I would enjoy driving on a weekly basis and ones that I would enjoy as a weekend driver. If someone offered me a Dodge Viper with a Hennesy Package upgrade vs a Ferrari I would chose the Viper. I love audi's because they are the best handeling cars in any condition (I am not saying the best in perfect wether cause we all know they are not). And you comment about german engineering (in general). Drive on an American Road, a road in Japan and then a road in german, you tell me which is the best. I already know the answer. Where I live American Engineers couldnt cut it and they hired to the same German Firm that fixed parts of the autobahn to fix one of the largest intersections in the US. Its about 75% done and 400% better. I just think your pissed off that they increased the price and I do agree with you that the root of all evil lies in another company, specifically BMW who drived pricing up and now Audi has decided as long as they stay right under there pricing they are fine. Just be happy the S4 isnt 5K above the M3 is all I can say. (for the rest of you.... sorry for the rant)

mm

Thank you, it is so nice to hear a voice or reason here.

mm

German roads are in better condition and better designed than US roads because THEY PAY MORE FOR THEM AND PUT MORE EMPHASIS ON THEM, given the nature of the high speed sections of the Autobahn, they HAVE to. German engineers are no better or worse than American or Japanese Engineers, and your example about the German firm redesigning roads in your area is nothing more than evidence of an increasingly global and highly competitive engineering market.

But of course, what would I know about engineering, it's not like I'm an Engineer or anything... oh, wait, yes, in fact, I am. Oh, but it's not like I work with German Engineers or anything... oh, wait, yes, in fact, I do.

Oversized Rooster

Wrong. Japanese will never reach the German level of performance...

mm

Your screen name suggests to me that you're little more than a troll though, is that correct?

Vtec_Killer

I guess you've never heard of Nissan then

outofca

you're a tool...