Would you consider the S60R?
05-24-2003, 04:40 PM
#11
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That may be the case.......
I know what MB says about CR, but the fact still remains....CR is still basically the only publication that rates cars the way they do. So, there isn't much else to gauge off of.
Either way, I'm not saying one make is more reliable than the other (just said the A4 rates below the S60, that's all). I'm not about to poll 500 owners myself on the problems they have, so you take whats out there.
Anyway, both cars are going to have problems.
Either way, I'm not saying one make is more reliable than the other (just said the A4 rates below the S60, that's all). I'm not about to poll 500 owners myself on the problems they have, so you take whats out there.
Anyway, both cars are going to have problems.
05-25-2003, 07:04 AM
#13
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Re: NO. S60R = Torque Steer + Turbo lag + sloppy cornering ... you'll regret it.
The car has no Torque Steer, its AWD. Sloppy Cornering? You must be kidding. There is a little turbo lag, but its far from anything crazy.
Try actually driving the car instead of being an Armchair enthusiast, its more fun that way.
Try actually driving the car instead of being an Armchair enthusiast, its more fun that way.
05-25-2003, 07:19 AM
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I agree with most of your points
Volvo is using Haldex for AWD. The same system Audi is using for the TT, the torque steer is noticeble on moderate to hard launches. Keep in mind the Haldex system is 100% FWD based (at least in the TT), unless slipage is detected, at which point it can direct power to the wheels that grip. Its not a constant AWD system.
This isn't to say that the Volvo does have Torque steer, like the TT. I haven't driven the S60R so I can't really speculate. One thing to keep in mind is that its possible to program the Haldex unit to vary the split, i.e. 50-50. Now the only question that remains is.... Were the Volvo engineers smart enough to program the unit correctly.
Just stating the facts here, personally I really like this car and would consider buying it if I had the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.
This isn't to say that the Volvo does have Torque steer, like the TT. I haven't driven the S60R so I can't really speculate. One thing to keep in mind is that its possible to program the Haldex unit to vary the split, i.e. 50-50. Now the only question that remains is.... Were the Volvo engineers smart enough to program the unit correctly.
Just stating the facts here, personally I really like this car and would consider buying it if I had the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.
05-25-2003, 08:07 AM
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Re: I agree with most of your points
You are still at 95% FWD when on dry pavement and 50%-50% when under WOT. So there isn't any tendency to go from one side to the other under hard launch. The car is primarily FWD until the 4C system detects a situation which would benefit from more rear wheel power bias. Up to 95% of the S60Rs power can be transferred to the rear wheels.
05-25-2003, 10:04 AM
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Re: That's exactly what I thought, the TT's haldex AWD system works the same way.
No problem at all....just thought I would add that the S60R's AWD system is extremely advanced because it's an integration of Haldex II, 4C active chassis system that changes settings 500 times/second, closed Area Network and ECU. This system distributes power based on acceleration, lateral acceleration, etc. So it understeers entering a corner, oversteers on exit, and is neutral at the apex.
05-25-2003, 10:10 AM
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WRONG
You are incorrect in this case. Your description is accurate for Haldex I used on Audi A3 and TT as well as Volvo S60 AWD and XC70 Cross Country.
The S60R, V70R, and possibly the XC90 (I need to check) used Haldex II which is a completely new technology. Haldex II distributes power not only based on wheel slip but also on acceleration demands. In other words it is optimized for performance and distributes power to optimize launch and acceleration peaks.
If what I've heard (which I don't give much more credence than rumor at this point) is accurate Audi will be moving to Haldex II not only for transverse mounted engines but all cars in the next few years. Again, I can't confirm it at this point but based on the performance characteristics of vehicles with Haldex II it makes sense that Audi will either adapt it or develop a similar application.
Thanks.
-rollie
rdollie@att.net
The S60R, V70R, and possibly the XC90 (I need to check) used Haldex II which is a completely new technology. Haldex II distributes power not only based on wheel slip but also on acceleration demands. In other words it is optimized for performance and distributes power to optimize launch and acceleration peaks.
If what I've heard (which I don't give much more credence than rumor at this point) is accurate Audi will be moving to Haldex II not only for transverse mounted engines but all cars in the next few years. Again, I can't confirm it at this point but based on the performance characteristics of vehicles with Haldex II it makes sense that Audi will either adapt it or develop a similar application.
Thanks.
-rollie
rdollie@att.net
05-25-2003, 10:12 AM
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Re: That's exactly what I thought, the TT's haldex AWD system works the same way.
Your description is accurate for Haldex I used on Audi A3 and TT as well as Volvo S60 AWD and XC70 Cross Country.
The S60R, V70R, and possibly the XC90 (I need to check) used Haldex II which is a completely new technology. Haldex II distributes power not only based on wheel slip but also on acceleration demands. In other words it is optimized for performance and distributes power to optimize launch and acceleration peaks.
If what I've heard (which I don't give much more credence than rumor at this point) is accurate Audi will be moving to Haldex II not only for transverse mounted engines but all cars in the next few years. Again, I can't confirm it at this point but based on the performance characteristics of vehicles with Haldex II it makes sense that Audi will either adapt it or develop a similar application.
Thanks.
-rollie
rdollie@att.net
The S60R, V70R, and possibly the XC90 (I need to check) used Haldex II which is a completely new technology. Haldex II distributes power not only based on wheel slip but also on acceleration demands. In other words it is optimized for performance and distributes power to optimize launch and acceleration peaks.
If what I've heard (which I don't give much more credence than rumor at this point) is accurate Audi will be moving to Haldex II not only for transverse mounted engines but all cars in the next few years. Again, I can't confirm it at this point but based on the performance characteristics of vehicles with Haldex II it makes sense that Audi will either adapt it or develop a similar application.
Thanks.
-rollie
rdollie@att.net