FYI, regarding the AWE Tuning RSK04 fueling kit:
well maybe yours does J/K
05-11-2006, 01:21 PM
#13
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well put Todd......
thats been my point with the other kits out there. You can run more boost (via other kits or Homebrew) and the car will be faster. But it's a choice to each owner to what's more important to them. IMHO...all the kits are in the relative ballpark nowadays.
05-11-2006, 01:28 PM
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you're not the only company w/that opinion. I get right at 20psi w/APR
I would also love to run into the higher hp danger areas of the compressor map.
The truth is, I would not be happy replacing the turbos every other year.
Then again, if that kind of boost kills K04 turbos.. shouldn't we already have failure reports from the homebrew crowd? Maybe street driving with the higher boost doesn't hurt as much because you're not running at redline/wot as often.
The truth is, I would not be happy replacing the turbos every other year. Then again, if that kind of boost kills K04 turbos.. shouldn't we already have failure reports from the homebrew crowd? Maybe street driving with the higher boost doesn't hurt as much because you're not running at redline/wot as often.
05-11-2006, 01:29 PM
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Some responses:
20 psi of boost at 3000 rpms is quite different than 20 psi of boost at 7000 rpms.
Depending on the health/accuracy of a given car's N75 valve, you will see 20-23psi of boost on initial ramp up with our kit. The "overshoot" varies depending on car and the gear. The faster the engine acceleration (due to lower gears), the more tendency to overshoot due to the reaction time of the factory N75 at that high a boost level.
So we are confortable with some cars spiking to 23psi down low in the 3-4000rpms range. It is a compromise that we decided to live with given the mass market for this kit and all the mechanical variations you see when you go mass market.
We are comfortable with that kind of boost down low, when it happens, because the knock voltages, injector pulse widths, etc. are all within safe ranges for the hardware we provide and intend the kit to be coupled with. And that kind of boost at those engine speeds is not that far off the higher efficiency islands of the RS4 K04 compressor maps
Running over 20 psi at 6-7k rpms not only starts straying into a very inefficient area of the compressor maps, but knock voltages, injector duty cycle, etc. all start climbing.
It is the amount of headroom left in the hardware that we are most concerned about. Running components so close or at their limits goes against conventional wisdom with a mass market kit.
It may not make for the absolute fastest results, but we feel the results are quite impressive nonetheless and we can still sleep at night knowing that we have not pushed everything to the limit.
To make matters more "gray", there is a lot of unknowns when it comes to the mechanical limits of this engine. Do not forget that 20psi is almost TRIPLE what the engine was designed to run at. Once again, our criteria of mass market reliability dictates that we err on the side of caution, again. This is not something a scan tool can tell you: you will not see a rod about to break from too much cylinder pressure.
And a comprehensive test protocol to push and find the limits of this engine *before* bringing a product to market is not really feasible with this particular market's economics (think low volume and relatively low margin considering that low volume). That is another reason for us to err on the side of caution.
No one in the aftermarket really *knows* the engine's limits, but there is a difference between letting your clients be your guinea pigs with potential catastrophic disaster and declining to push things that far just for the sake of making big claims.
Depending on the health/accuracy of a given car's N75 valve, you will see 20-23psi of boost on initial ramp up with our kit. The "overshoot" varies depending on car and the gear. The faster the engine acceleration (due to lower gears), the more tendency to overshoot due to the reaction time of the factory N75 at that high a boost level.
So we are confortable with some cars spiking to 23psi down low in the 3-4000rpms range. It is a compromise that we decided to live with given the mass market for this kit and all the mechanical variations you see when you go mass market.
We are comfortable with that kind of boost down low, when it happens, because the knock voltages, injector pulse widths, etc. are all within safe ranges for the hardware we provide and intend the kit to be coupled with. And that kind of boost at those engine speeds is not that far off the higher efficiency islands of the RS4 K04 compressor maps
Running over 20 psi at 6-7k rpms not only starts straying into a very inefficient area of the compressor maps, but knock voltages, injector duty cycle, etc. all start climbing.
It is the amount of headroom left in the hardware that we are most concerned about. Running components so close or at their limits goes against conventional wisdom with a mass market kit.
It may not make for the absolute fastest results, but we feel the results are quite impressive nonetheless and we can still sleep at night knowing that we have not pushed everything to the limit.
To make matters more "gray", there is a lot of unknowns when it comes to the mechanical limits of this engine. Do not forget that 20psi is almost TRIPLE what the engine was designed to run at. Once again, our criteria of mass market reliability dictates that we err on the side of caution, again. This is not something a scan tool can tell you: you will not see a rod about to break from too much cylinder pressure.
And a comprehensive test protocol to push and find the limits of this engine *before* bringing a product to market is not really feasible with this particular market's economics (think low volume and relatively low margin considering that low volume). That is another reason for us to err on the side of caution.
No one in the aftermarket really *knows* the engine's limits, but there is a difference between letting your clients be your guinea pigs with potential catastrophic disaster and declining to push things that far just for the sake of making big claims.