Love both the e46 M3 and the S4 but....
05-21-2002, 07:52 AM
#21
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True. The E46 and S4 are very similar cars though all in all.
Audi wins (in most minds) in the fit, finish, luxury catergory, but the E46 is certainly no slouch.
BMW consistantly has better performance STOCK thru most of its comparison models (S4-E46, A4 1.8T-318i, etc.). Not that Audi performance is bad, just that in general, BMW engines, suspension, and trannys are preferred.
In most comparison tests I've seen, the Audi's win, not by much, but they win. The deciding factor is typically value for your money.
Therefore I prefer the Audis (and many on this board do too I imagine) because with the money you save, you can spend on mods that will increase the Audi performance to equal or above the BMW level, but have greater luxury.
Adding mods levels the playing field in most cases in performance AND cost. It's unfair to only compare one variable. The point is to get as close to apples to apples as possible. Otherwise, then yes, you have to compare NOS'd Civics, GT2s and such. IMHO of course.
BMW consistantly has better performance STOCK thru most of its comparison models (S4-E46, A4 1.8T-318i, etc.). Not that Audi performance is bad, just that in general, BMW engines, suspension, and trannys are preferred.
In most comparison tests I've seen, the Audi's win, not by much, but they win. The deciding factor is typically value for your money.
Therefore I prefer the Audis (and many on this board do too I imagine) because with the money you save, you can spend on mods that will increase the Audi performance to equal or above the BMW level, but have greater luxury.
Adding mods levels the playing field in most cases in performance AND cost. It's unfair to only compare one variable. The point is to get as close to apples to apples as possible. Otherwise, then yes, you have to compare NOS'd Civics, GT2s and such. IMHO of course.
05-21-2002, 08:03 AM
#24
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i Agree..
1/4 mile times arent everything. Cars need to be compared overall to each other. But all i hear on this board is can i beat a stock m3 in a straight up race with a moded s4. And how many car owners actually take their cars to a race track? im guessing a very low percentage. No need to get defensive people...if i had my choice i would have an s4,moded of course =)
05-21-2002, 08:09 AM
#25
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So what? Stock vs stock? The prices are not similair. A Z06 is cheaper than an E46 m3? Want to talk
stock vs stock?
Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?
You are not comparing apples to apples. When a car costs $15-16k more than another, equally equipped, why are you surpised it's faster stock?
I'll make you a deal. You put $1400 into an E46 M3 and see what you turn, as I put into my S4 that is over 1 second faster in the 1/4, 0-60 in 4.6 seconds and runs 174+ mph.
THE PROBLEM with the E46 M3 is that it's already tapped out. AS I ASKED YOU BEFORE, please show me a supercharger kit for the E46 M3? I have never seen an E46 M3 run any faster than 13.3 in person (spend a lot of time at the track) or heard of one running faster than a 13.08.
Remember, for $45K, you can have an S4 that runs 13 flats, 0-60 in 4.6-4.7 seconds, a top speed over 174mph, the ability to drive in snow and rain at a moderate pace (vs at all!), and a car with apparently less engine problems chipped than the E46 M3 stock (87 blown engines at the M3 forum for a first model year car vs about 50 bolow turbos for three model years of cars).
Why don't you just take your M3 interest to the M3 page.
Mike S
Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?
You are not comparing apples to apples. When a car costs $15-16k more than another, equally equipped, why are you surpised it's faster stock?
I'll make you a deal. You put $1400 into an E46 M3 and see what you turn, as I put into my S4 that is over 1 second faster in the 1/4, 0-60 in 4.6 seconds and runs 174+ mph.
THE PROBLEM with the E46 M3 is that it's already tapped out. AS I ASKED YOU BEFORE, please show me a supercharger kit for the E46 M3? I have never seen an E46 M3 run any faster than 13.3 in person (spend a lot of time at the track) or heard of one running faster than a 13.08.
Remember, for $45K, you can have an S4 that runs 13 flats, 0-60 in 4.6-4.7 seconds, a top speed over 174mph, the ability to drive in snow and rain at a moderate pace (vs at all!), and a car with apparently less engine problems chipped than the E46 M3 stock (87 blown engines at the M3 forum for a first model year car vs about 50 bolow turbos for three model years of cars).
Why don't you just take your M3 interest to the M3 page.
Mike S
05-21-2002, 08:12 AM
#26
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I have a hard time comparing an E46 to say SilverBullet's 11.97s S4.
That's not really fair to the E46.
However one primary advantage to the turbos is a simple $1000 chip will almost equal the performance, and with <$2500 the S4 should be equal with the E46. I believe I'm correct in saying current S4 was designed to compete with the E36, not E46, which it does well.
I would agree, once you get up to about $10K in mods, that's pretty serious. Depends where folks want to draw a line in the sand, but $2500 is less than a decent wheel/tire set, and it will get you an S4 that will equal or beat an E46. That's a nice selling point I think, and gives you a good feeling of the value of an S4 and it's performance/$ ratio.
However one primary advantage to the turbos is a simple $1000 chip will almost equal the performance, and with <$2500 the S4 should be equal with the E46. I believe I'm correct in saying current S4 was designed to compete with the E36, not E46, which it does well.
I would agree, once you get up to about $10K in mods, that's pretty serious. Depends where folks want to draw a line in the sand, but $2500 is less than a decent wheel/tire set, and it will get you an S4 that will equal or beat an E46. That's a nice selling point I think, and gives you a good feeling of the value of an S4 and it's performance/$ ratio.
05-21-2002, 08:18 AM
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hehe thanx adam...And by the way theres a s4 in my driveway not an M3 so relax...it was a simple
question on comparing stock and moded cars to get a conversation going. I wasnt talking about prices and what they cost. And i agree the s4 is an overall better car when you consider performance and everything else and even better when you throw a little money into it. Just a general question on how fair it is to compare a stock and a moded car. No need to get all upset...Take it easy buddy...
