X-Tonic Tiptronic

that pretty much limits users to SoCal, New Mex, Arizona etc and only during summer.

Mark P

Here's Knock Activity for Aquamist on, +0 timing vs +3 timing. Do you see any obvious difference?
<img src="http://ctny.audiworld.com/mark/s4/aquamist/dynoday2_results/knock_wwo3tim.gif">




And here's Knock Activity for Aquamist on vs off. See any difference here either?
<img src="http://ctny.audiworld.com/mark/s4/aquamist/dynoday2_results/knock_wwo_AM.gif">

Well, in these same runs (AM on vs off), here is the resulting Timing, so as you can see, there is an improvement that is not obvious from knock activity alone:
<img src="http://ctny.audiworld.com/mark/s4/aquamist/dynoday2_results/timing_indcyl_wwo_AM.gif">

Zold-manS8

a 3 degree increace in timing. I would say that you would / could need to add timing to the point where you see higher peak voltage values to find a threshold and detimine what the AM is doing for you... maybe there is more room for more timing?

on the other hand - mid 20s is about the max that you want to see from what I understand.

Great install Mark, cleanest one I have seen documented!

Thanks for sharing your info in such detail!

J.Moss@TorqueFactory

Relatively simple test when not at a dyno day!

Max out power safely on available conditions, with and without H20. With a Lemmi program this can be done fairly quickly. Than the chips fall where they fall.

Jason @ Streetwerke

State high temperature records

State Temp Date Station Elevation (feet)
Ala. 112 Sept. 5, 1925 Centerville 345
Alaska 100 June 27, 1915 Ft. Yukon 420*
Ariz. 128 June 29, 1994 Lake Havasu 505
Ark. 120 Aug. 10, 1936 Ozark 396
Calif. 134 July 10, 1913 Death Valley N/A
Colo. 118 July 11, 1888 Bennett 5,484
Conn. 106 July 15, 1995 Danbury 450
Del. 110 July 21, 1930 Millsboro 20
Fla. 109 June 29, 1931 Monticell0 207
Ga. 112 July 24, 1952 Louisville 132
Hawaii 100 April 27,1931 Pahala 850
Idaho 118 July 28, 1934 Orofino 1,027
Ill. 117 July 14, 1954 E. St Louis 410
Ind. 116 July 14, 1936 Collegeville 672
Iowa 118 July 20, 1934 Keokuk 614
Kansas 121 July 24, 1936 Alton 1,651
Ky. 114 July 28, 1930 Greensburg 581
La. 114 Aug. 10, 1936 Plain Dealing 268
Maine 105 July 10, 1911 N. Bridgton 450
Md. 109 July 10, 1936 Cumberland and Frederick 623, 325
Mass. 107 Aug. 2, 1975 New Bedford and Chester 120, 640
Mich. 112 July 13, 1936 Mio 963
Minn. 114 July 6, 1936 Moorhead 904
Miss. 115 July 29, 1930 Holly Springs 600
Mo 118 July 14, 1954 Warsaw and Union 705, 560
Mont. 117 July 5, 1937 Medicine Lake 1,950
Neb. 118 July 24, 1936 Minden 2,169
Nev. 125 June 29, 1994 Laughlin 605
N.H. 106 July 4, 1911 Nashua 125
N.J. 110 July 10, 1936 Runyon 18
N.M. 122 June 27, 1994 Lakewood N/A
N.Y. 108 July 22, 1926 Troy 35
N.C. 110 Aug. 21, 1983 Fayetteville 213
N.D. 121 July 6, 1936 Steele 1,857
Ohio 113 July 21, 1934 Gallipolis 673
Okla. 120 June 27, 1994 Tipton 1,350
Ore. 119 Aug. 10, 1898 Pendleton 1,074
Pa. 111 July 10, 1936 Phoenixville 100
R.I. 104 Aug. 2, 1975 Providence 51
S.C. 111 June 28, 1954 Camden 170
S.D. 120 July 5, 1936 Gannvalley 1,750
Tenn. 113 Aug. 9, 1930 Perryville 377
Texas 120 Aug. 12, 1936 Seymour 1,291
Utah 117 July 5, 1985 Saint George 2,880
Vt. 105 July 4, 1911 Vernon 310
Va. 110 July 15, 1954 Balcony Falls 725
Wash. 118 Aug. 5, 1961 Ice Harbor Dam 475 475
W. Va. 112 July 10, 1936 Martinsburg 435
Wis. 114 July 13, 1936 Wisconsin Dells 900
Wyo. 116 Aug. 8, 1983 Basin 3,500
*Elevation estimated

Source: U.S. National Climatic Date Center (last updated December 2000)

dscottjr

for about 3-4 months every year.

Hal_TT::CBP

Motronic thinks of this as well... since your knocks did not change with 3deg and AM on. When I Lemmi with timing I can advance all day long and the knocks max in the low 20s(APR Stg2 mostly, some 8J X testing with this, both on 93) however the CF shows the pull-backs vs seeing it based on the knocks alone.

Timing seems to stay in the high teens on both max, but there is some initial advantage in the midrange - up to maybe 5K before the CFs kick in.

Impressed with the data Mark. I need to get ECU Explorer... even with HexCan two blocks retard the sampling to .4-.5 secs. Ugh.

Funkweasel

tweak your fueling with lemmiwinks to lean out the a/f. From the curves it looks like you have no done that. They don't only dump fuel when iats get too high, they also run on the rich side to suppress knock. You can lean that out to make more power.

You also might be running too much water in the midrange. Can you lessen that(ie are there maps you can tweak on the water computer)? Some of the power gains from the iat drop could be removed by the presence of too much water, which effectively reduces the displacement of the motor.

Another thing, there is a significant "non-detonation" component in those knock voltages. So there may be more going on that it first appears. The only way to check would be to move the timing up to the point that you hear knock. In your case it could be a point well past saturation(29V or so). Interesting(but care is very needed here) experiment.

Anyway good info.

Mark P

Define "Max out power safely". Let me know how you'd like me to test it and I will (provided I feel comfortable doing so). If you are going to refer to Knock Activity as a measure, please define paramaters based on the following type of data logging (ie, let me know whether you are talking about absolute peak single data point, or average of highest clylinder, or average of all cylinders, etc):

Generic log showing ECUx Knock Voltage loging:
<img src="http://ctny.audiworld.com/mark/s4/misc_data/knock_output.gif">

Mark P

Indeed, I see more timing regard in areas with +3 timing (where overall timing stayed the same), as expected