VAP

I combed the Bentley CD last night looking for a way to do this. The Bentley CD is a POS as far as techical drawings or explicit detail goes but far as I can tell the quattro has 4 places on each lateral control arm that could be altered/modified to reduce (or even adjust) negative camber.

First off there are 4 lateral control arms used in the rear of the TTQ. One each; upper/lower/left/right. Each control arm attaches to the rear sub-frame on the inboard side thru welded brackets on the sub-frame via a bolt through a pressed-in rubber bushing at the control arms inboard end. It then attaches to the rear wheel hub assembly on the outboard side at an upper/lower "bushing'd" mounting point located at the wheel hub by the same "bolt-thru" assembly. Only difference is on the inboard side the bushing is in the control arm and outboard side the bushing is in the wheel hub assembly. And this carries thru regardless of upper/lower or left/right orientation.

Ways to adjust negative camber in this situation are abundant. You could slot or "ovalize" rear outboard mounting points on the lateral control arms. You could do the same on the inboard sub-frame mounting points. You could press out the rubber bushing at the inboard control arm mounting point and have eccentric (offset) Delrin bushings made to replace them (eccentric is where the bolt thru sleeve is bored thru the bushing offset rather than thru its true center thereby when you turn the bushing you either pull in or push out any of the 4 lateral control arms). Inboard is the place to do this as it has but one pivot point. Go to the outboard side and you have to do it in pairs (upper and lower control arm). Dont worry about what you've heard that Delrin squeaks... it doesnt. Its self-lubricating and harder than the rubber thats currently in there. Also, dont fret about your ride becoming "hard/harsh"... it wont. These are not shock absorbing pivot points. They are only rotational pivots. Your camber settings will last longer and be more easily attained and hold their settings even better than the car does now. Sure you'll fell it in the seat of your pants... but only by virtue of how much more precise and true the car holds its setting thru ALL kinds of steering input, whether on street or track.

Now, I saved the best for last. For those that want to REALLY do this right, there always upper & lower adjustable lateral control arms. Basically a modified "tie-rod" with a threaded inner sleeve. Just trun the center section top & bottom and dial in about any amount of + or - camber you could ever want... even if you're not lowered.

None of this is big ticket money-wise cept for the final option. And even that one could be done with some junkyard savvy for probably less than $100. Even a custom-built setup would probably be less than $500 and maybe less than $300 if multiple sets were made at the same time.

I'd love to help you guys out on this. But there's nothing in it for me. I'm FWD and I have to get a LOT more resourceful than this to get my rear camber adjustable. I'll find a way tho, trust me.

But you Q guys have a way... several ways actually. The answers were just provided you. The solutions are up to you. Someone go do this thing. And give Brad a set, wouldya!?!

;-)

Just Plain Cliff

with each option. Let you know what I find out when I speak to him.

EighTT

Thanks Mance. The suspension shop I took my TT too said that they could slot it for about $90. However, he said that his biggest concern was that the spring was 100% compressed at rest, and was not able to function properly in such a state.

I also wonder why others are getting rear camber readings of -2 degrees or less without modifications, and I am getting -3.5. There must be something they are doing that I am not, or vice-versa. I'm hoping that raising the car a bit will help to solve both problems.

Colonel Bogey

<p><img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/AudiWorldPics/2000/cbsigx.jpg" borders="0">

VAP

springs are "stacked" is that your car is too low. I remember when you had it done and you said the place that did it recommended you only lower it a half inch. Then you posted a pic showing it lowered and I commented then that the car in that pic was lowered, but not by a half inch... more like 1.5-2". I dont know if they measured wrong before they lowered it or what happened. But your car is TOO FRIGGIN LOW! Thats all there is to it. I know you have confidence in those guys that did it for you but truth is they havent done what they were paid to do... what they recommended to you (1/2" lower) and what you agreed to have done,(again 1/2" lower).

This is not a very complex rear-end in the quattro or FWD versions. If your springs are stacked, you're too low. Don't look any furher than that. Nothing else would've been altered/modified when they installed the coilovers. Wouldnt surprise me to find out that your upper perch adjusters are turned ALL the way up. Have them babies cranked down to the fraction numbers numbers on the threaded adjusters that CB and JPC have sent you and your probs will summarily disappear. Dont go looking for "other" probs till you get your TT back up in the air by about 1-1.5". Then if you still have 3* or more "negative" camber I'll be gape-jawed surprised and only then should you look beyond raising the vehicle to find any "other" probs/causes to this camber issue. But you wont find them. Your car is just adjusted too damn low.

Go back and get what you paid for at the install WITH a fresh alignment at some place with a Hunter machine. The day you do that is the day you're fixed. And if your original installation place is unable or unwilling to do that for you then find another place. You should not have to deal with this. And just cuz someone hangs a shingle out that says "Racing" and works primarily works on Porsches does not a brilliant shop make.

If this place cant do what YOU want, move to the next one. This aint rocket science... hell it aint even difficult. They should never sent you out of their shop with 3.5* negative camber and your coilsprings stacked.

I wouldnt even go back... I'd go somewhere else.

Colonel Bogey

see the additional space to compress on the lower winding. Bottom line...it works and I burned down two tires under very, very hard driving proving it! Love em'. Thanks to ExTTreme, this is the most important mod I have done to TT to date...far more important than chipping, IMHO!

I can get into corners and enjoy the SPORT car in a way no amount of horsepressure would help without the H&R coil-over kit. Worth every damn nickle I paid!<p><img src="http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/AudiWorldPics/2000/cbsigx.jpg" borders="0">

Just Plain Cliff

Best modification made to date. The pictures of your rear springs are very similar to how my springs look, with center coils stacked and end coils open. Wish I had copies here so I could post them (maybe later this evening).

The Matt Curry I refer to in the post below owns his own tuning shop. He was also my instructor at Summit Point. After our "ride", he asked what I had done to the suspension, saying it was the best set up car he had ridden in that day. When I told him H&R coilovers he said that explained it. Yes, they do make a MAJOR difference; it is by no means subtle.

Later that evening I spoke with Matt about the negative camber situation, and told him of the difficulties involved with adjusting it out. He said it could be adjusted out, adding that "anything can be done if the money is right". Then he smiled and added, "but in this case it would not take a whole lot of money". So I think I'll pursue this with him shortly, and see what he was thinking about. I imagine something similar to what Mance outlined above. We will see.

EighTT

I think you're probably right. I'm going to attempt to get them do it right. They actively solicited me for these, calling me and offering a good deal (below Tire Rack's price).

I paid decent money to have these installed, and there's no reason that they shouldn't be able to do the job right. Obviously, something's amiss, but I'm going to get them to correct the problem out of principle.

EighTT

That most/all of the problems can be traced to the installation. The folks at AJ are nice enough, but I get the feeling that they just want to get paid to slap the coilovers in, and then have me go away.

This is very much contrary to the way I conduct my business. I am highly unhappy when things do not go right, and do not rest until the client is happy (so long as they're remotely reasonable). Unfortunately, not everyone conducts their business in the same manner.

Larrytt

Can you measure from the bottom of the wheel arch to the center of the wheel? With this figure, everyone will be able to tell you with 100% certainty how much your car is lowered! Take this measurement for both the front and back and also do it side to side to see if they lowered you evenly.

At least I would find this of interest. Can CB and Cliff do the same and then we can compare the numbers?