Real info on Dahlback intake.....
12-14-2004, 01:59 PM
#1
Real info on Dahlback intake.....
this is a cut and paste but with posting it on a couple of sites, it gets a bit tiresome =-)
Gotta start off by saying the guys at http://tjmmotorsport.com stand by their products....I told them that I was going to do this testing once and for all, and they told me that if for any reason I was not happy with the manifold I could return it and they would refund me the dyno time. They had no problem with me posting about what the products do.....they were not interested in anything more than me posting the facts... Fair enough...
Baseline Car is APR ST3 with Forge FMIC, BMC Intake and stock 225 intake Manifold.
I dynoed the car about 2 yrs ago and got what I thought were respectable #'s, many said they weren't *real* numbers because technically I did have 100 oct in the tank, while running the APR 93 program. For my first ever dyno, I wanted to have a 93 and a 100 oct run just to see what it pulls....however, it DID have 100 oct in the tank with the 93 program running but there is no other way of doing it short of draining the fuel tank
The first dyno is from 2 yrs ago and the car mechanically is the same, nothing had been added or changed....NOTHING. The only 2 differences between then and now is that this time, no 100 octane whatsover and this time of year, the weather is much better turbo weather so keep that in mind...
1st one done in 2002 83* and 29% humidty
2nd one done in 2004 66* and 9% humidty
I set myself up thinking that the dyno WAS going to be worse because of the 100 octane thing.....
However.....
Dyno 003 is 2002
Dyno 004 is 2004
Zero smoothing and SAE CF
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/2002+vs+2004+baseline.jpg">
These overlayed dynos were about 1 min 30 sec from each other today with no changes...just how I drove it in...stock 225 manifold.
Zero smoothing and SAE CF
Dyno 004 is the first baseline run
Dyno 005 is the second baseline run
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/stock+225+manifold+run1+vs+run+2.jpg">
On to the goodstuff.....
Dyno 04 is the 1st baseline today with stock 225 manifold
Dyno 06 is the 1st baseline with the new Dahlback manifold...no other changes.
The #'s are there in black and white.
Zero smoothing and SAE CF
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/225+vs+dahlback.jpg">
Numbers speak for themselves...
Figure 284 vs 290 hp rounding it out.... Not bad at all
However, there was about the same loss of 7 ft / lbs on the torque
in the same spot and rpm range...
Kind of cancels it out depending on how you look at it....
Here is one more dyno chart that I thought was interesting, not for any other reason than to debate that a smoothed dyno chart is MUCH different than your regular UNsmoothed dyno chart, notice that this chart is exactly the same as the one above, just with a dynojet smoothing factor of 5 (which happens to be the highest on a 0-5 scale)
Gain of about 8 hp and the loss of 8ft/lbs tq.... weird. I guess I thought smoothing it would make the variations *less* between variables, not more....oh well.
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/225+vs+dahlback+smoothed+graph.jpg">
On the way home from NGP http://www.ngpracing.com (who graciously allowed me to hold up the dyno for the whole day while I switched manifolds and allowed me to bum a few clamps and stuff)
I called Randy at TJM and told him the news...I gave him the decency of letting him know the results 1st before I posted em here for you guys...
I got home and sent him the dyno files (btw if anyone wants me to send them so you can view them with the dynojet file reader and get all the specs, temp, humidity, time rpm, A/f ratio etc.....IM and I will send them to you...) and we talked about the results...
We talked about whether we should have reset the ecu's each time before the 2 major runs, but I thought it to be bad to reset the fuel trim and any other adaptations right before you rev the crap out of your car on the dyno.
We talked about whether I did a recalibration of the throttle body ( I did not) since it was unplugged and then replugged in ???(Any insight on whether that matters???)
Randy at TJM thought that the #'s were not what they had hoped for because they had a bit different results but they never had #'s to compare like what I did today. They had always resest the T.B. and driven the car in between dynos...
Randy asked if I would be willing to get back to the dyno shortly at his expense and retest the setup after the car had been driven a bit and had time to adapt.
No problemo....
Here is the deal, its the holidays coming up very shortly and I work in retail...so it is a busy time for me :biggrinsanta: but in a week or so after the new year I will be back on the dyno to see what happens....The shop stays a pretty consistent temp with the heaters this time of year, and as long as there is not alot of humidity...the #'s should be comparable....
After the ride home tonight, I have no intentions of taking this manifold off the car...I had my chance to send it back with refund of everything and only be out my time today...Nope, it is staying on the car.
I have owned the car 4 yrs, 2 years with the APR Stg 3 and I have NEVER broke the wheels loose in 3rd gear except when I had 100 oct in the car....only times.
Today, with 93 in the tank and the 93 program.......broke the wheels loose in 3rd.....in a heavy TT....I'll take that
Syay tuned for more info.....
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/dahlback+intake+005.jpg">
Gotta start off by saying the guys at http://tjmmotorsport.com stand by their products....I told them that I was going to do this testing once and for all, and they told me that if for any reason I was not happy with the manifold I could return it and they would refund me the dyno time. They had no problem with me posting about what the products do.....they were not interested in anything more than me posting the facts... Fair enough...
Baseline Car is APR ST3 with Forge FMIC, BMC Intake and stock 225 intake Manifold.
I dynoed the car about 2 yrs ago and got what I thought were respectable #'s, many said they weren't *real* numbers because technically I did have 100 oct in the tank, while running the APR 93 program. For my first ever dyno, I wanted to have a 93 and a 100 oct run just to see what it pulls....however, it DID have 100 oct in the tank with the 93 program running but there is no other way of doing it short of draining the fuel tank
The first dyno is from 2 yrs ago and the car mechanically is the same, nothing had been added or changed....NOTHING. The only 2 differences between then and now is that this time, no 100 octane whatsover and this time of year, the weather is much better turbo weather so keep that in mind...
1st one done in 2002 83* and 29% humidty
2nd one done in 2004 66* and 9% humidty
I set myself up thinking that the dyno WAS going to be worse because of the 100 octane thing.....
However.....Dyno 003 is 2002
Dyno 004 is 2004
Zero smoothing and SAE CF
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/2002+vs+2004+baseline.jpg">
These overlayed dynos were about 1 min 30 sec from each other today with no changes...just how I drove it in...stock 225 manifold.
Zero smoothing and SAE CF
Dyno 004 is the first baseline run
Dyno 005 is the second baseline run
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/stock+225+manifold+run1+vs+run+2.jpg">
On to the goodstuff.....
Dyno 04 is the 1st baseline today with stock 225 manifold
Dyno 06 is the 1st baseline with the new Dahlback manifold...no other changes.
The #'s are there in black and white.
Zero smoothing and SAE CF
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/225+vs+dahlback.jpg">
Numbers speak for themselves...
Figure 284 vs 290 hp rounding it out.... Not bad at all
However, there was about the same loss of 7 ft / lbs on the torque
in the same spot and rpm range...Kind of cancels it out depending on how you look at it....
Here is one more dyno chart that I thought was interesting, not for any other reason than to debate that a smoothed dyno chart is MUCH different than your regular UNsmoothed dyno chart, notice that this chart is exactly the same as the one above, just with a dynojet smoothing factor of 5 (which happens to be the highest on a 0-5 scale)
Gain of about 8 hp and the loss of 8ft/lbs tq....
weird. I guess I thought smoothing it would make the variations *less* between variables, not more....oh well.<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/225+vs+dahlback+smoothed+graph.jpg">
On the way home from NGP http://www.ngpracing.com (who graciously allowed me to hold up the dyno for the whole day while I switched manifolds and allowed me to bum a few clamps and stuff)
I called Randy at TJM and told him the news...I gave him the decency of letting him know the results 1st before I posted em here for you guys...I got home and sent him the dyno files (btw if anyone wants me to send them so you can view them with the dynojet file reader and get all the specs, temp, humidity, time rpm, A/f ratio etc.....IM and I will send them to you...) and we talked about the results...
We talked about whether we should have reset the ecu's each time before the 2 major runs, but I thought it to be bad to reset the fuel trim and any other adaptations right before you rev the crap out of your car on the dyno.
We talked about whether I did a recalibration of the throttle body ( I did not) since it was unplugged and then replugged in ???(Any insight on whether that matters???)
Randy at TJM thought that the #'s were not what they had hoped for because they had a bit different results but they never had #'s to compare like what I did today. They had always resest the T.B. and driven the car in between dynos...
Randy asked if I would be willing to get back to the dyno shortly at his expense and retest the setup after the car had been driven a bit and had time to adapt.
No problemo....
Here is the deal, its the holidays coming up very shortly and I work in retail...so it is a busy time for me :biggrinsanta: but in a week or so after the new year I will be back on the dyno to see what happens....The shop stays a pretty consistent temp with the heaters this time of year, and as long as there is not alot of humidity...the #'s should be comparable....
After the ride home tonight, I have no intentions of taking this manifold off the car...I had my chance to send it back with refund of everything and only be out my time today...Nope, it is staying on the car.
I have owned the car 4 yrs, 2 years with the APR Stg 3 and I have NEVER broke the wheels loose in 3rd gear except when I had 100 oct in the car....only times.
Today, with 93 in the tank and the 93 program.......broke the wheels loose in 3rd.....in a heavy TT....I'll take that
Syay tuned for more info.....
<img src="http://pictureposter.allbrand.nu./pictures/hottub/dahlback/dahlback+intake+005.jpg">
12-14-2004, 02:16 PM
#5
I will tell you, I am gonna keep it..... I think just like other mods
it needed a bit of time to adapt. As far as some of the gains people have seen from this? No, it did not meet those expectations...but sometimes the first 100 hp is cheaper than the last 10. I want to retest it in a few weeks on comparable conditions and see what happens...seemed awfully strong to spin 3rd on the end of my travel home =-)
At $699 for the manifold, it is cheaper than most cat back exhausts and TONS of people buy those without any dyno proof, at least with this...you know what you are getting ;-)
I have to give credit to most of the owners of this intake, that gave realistic impressions of this manifold WITHOUT having #'s to back it up, most are honest in what to expect from it....I appreciate that in a person ;-)
At $699 for the manifold, it is cheaper than most cat back exhausts and TONS of people buy those without any dyno proof, at least with this...you know what you are getting ;-)
I have to give credit to most of the owners of this intake, that gave realistic impressions of this manifold WITHOUT having #'s to back it up, most are honest in what to expect from it....I appreciate that in a person ;-)
